When trying to think, reason and calculate to achieve a goal, man should ignore his emotions and not be guided by them, if he is to achieve his goal, unless goal is being emotional
If goal is being emotional (guided by emotions), then yeah a man can be guided by emotions.
But if goal is not emotional, then a path towards goal cannot be guided by emotions.
Even if emotions are included in the path, man is not guided by them but uses what logically achieves goal.
For example, if smiling and being happy increases odds of forming friendships, man here isnt guided by emotions, but by pure logic which says "smiling and being happy = achieves goal".
Calculation is always important, being guided purely by emotions means no calculation, and that makes goal less likely to be achieved.
Also, it is impossible to logically deduce what goal will be achieved, unless we use logic, not merely emotions.
Your argument shifts the claim. The topic says emotions should be ignored. You defend a position where emotions are used when they help achieve a goal. That is not the same claim. That is equivocation on what “guided by emotions” means.
If emotions are ignored, they play no role. If they are used instrumentally, they are part of the reasoning process. You cannot have both. The moment emotions are treated as useful inputs, the original claim is abandoned.
You also set up a false binary. Logic and emotion are not opposites. Emotions carry information about risk, value, motivation, and social consequences. Ignoring them is not rational. It is discarding relevant data.
Your own example shows this. If smiling and being happy improves outcomes, then emotional states are part of the causal path to the goal. Calling that “pure logic” is just relabeling emotion as logic.
Finally, logic alone does not generate goals. It tells you how to achieve them, not what to care about. Most goals are rooted in values, and values are tied to emotional structure.
So this is a bait and switch. The claim was “ignore emotions.” The defense becomes “use them strategically.” That concedes the point. The correct position is integration, not exclusion.
Pa sad ja ne znam kako to izgleda ugasiti emociju, kod mene nije to bas tako, jesam dolazio do momenata gdje sam toliko razoaran, da bih postao veliki gad i ono pokazao svim tim..Al nisam to nikada odabrao.. Pa iz mog trenutnog uglq u suštini emocija ili osjecaj po meni samo povecava tačnost rasuđivanja i naravno to kakvi smo sa introspekcijom, koliko je trenirana i ispitana, od strane svakog pojedinca.. Najslikovitije kako bih to kogao opisati ,kao da dva pogleda sa necim sto kruži oko njih..pogled je u pravcu onog sto nas zanima il glesamo i ima taj emocionalni kojk ide iz prsa.. i kako idu prema tački koju promatramo , negdje na sredini između dva lica... se sastavlja ono sto vidimo, pratimo ,osjecamo i jos nam intuicija daje te neke makro uglove . Naravno da je čovjek meksiranjiviji.. al isto tako i laksi bicem svojolim.. i definitivno cak i kada bih mogao samo glava il srce, ja bih opet osjecaj birao.. To je nekako bilo mnogo blize meni, pa kad nisam ni spoznavao da ja imam mjesti u svom bicu.. I ja nisam nikada bio takva osoba.. da gazim preko mrtvih , slabih, izgubljenih.. kako bi ja mozda et pobijedio ..ne.. jako mi je bitno ostati čovjek i mislim da onače je emocija pogresno shvaćena pogresno.. i mislim da i ti grijeaiš ti, jer ono kao kontas ma sa emocijom crs omeksat mozda .. kod mene nije bitno ko si.. ako si to si. Naravbo necdmo hodat okolo i prepricavat nekog, ja necu.. tako da . I NARWNO TREBA OPRAOSTIIT. BITI LAGANIJI. I PREMA SEB I LJUDI.A...Mouds jer si rek počela buditi, a naviku imas odavno.. Mislim da je to samo jos jedanpa mozda i najkvalitetnijih alata koje potiskujemo rad ovog il onog razlova.. A teb ne bi trebala biti razbacanost u glavi... mada se ti i poredaš..Al.skontala si valjda sa gubiš h tom obliku uvijek.. i da isti stimulans ubija emociju , posebno u tvom obliku, jer poticu iz istog ugla i onda dolaze kao savesena kombinacija za manipulisat , ne obuzdat ego.. sa emocijom ces samo jos mnogo dubljerazumjeti uz ono sto vec gledas.. Srećno.. Videi su dobri, al aljda znas da znam, sa mnogi tog radiš uzovas u tom... Al moram li ti opet rec nesto.. i jel ja aad trebam napravit neki potez, koji tebe nisam pitao obavijestio i slicno.. gdje ima tvoja anim slikaod strane mene..Znam da negsjenu ćošu ne želis i ne treba nam svađa.. Tako da stipu se gluposti.. svak moze pravit se lud , glup i nedodirlji .. a niko nije to..Miskiš da ja nisam imao bijes, da mi je bilo fino.. znas..
Title and Description, "When trying to think, reason and calculate to achieve a goal, man should ignore his emotions and not be guided by them, if he is to achieve his goal, unless goal is being emotional"
Being objective and detached, 'can let a person avoid tunnel vision I suppose. Open their eyes up to possible paths and viable options. Avoid the desperation that makes bad options seem ideal.
Course. . . Emotion is also what often drives a person 'to accomplish goals, Emotion something that 'focuses their interest in a task.
SatanLucy R1 "If goal is being emotional (guided by emotions), then yeah a man can be guided by emotions." Well. . . Wouldn't one best be able to determine what the best method of becoming and maintaining emotion be, by 'being unemotional objective?
The goal is something 'achieved, this debate is about method 'to the goal I 'think.
"Even if emotions are included in the path, man is not guided by them but uses what logically achieves goal." If a man cannot be guided by his emotions, can he be guided by the 'lack of emotions?
"For example, if smiling and being happy increases odds of forming friendships, man here isn't guided by emotions, but by pure logic which says "smiling and being happy = achieves goal"."
"man should ignore his emotions and not be guided by them," - Title, I think I get what you're saying, a person should not let wanting to be happy, overcome his goal of forming friendships. Maybe someone wants to feel happy, so they make sarcastic joke about someone they are trying to be friends with, because making that joke will make the joke teller feel happy. But people are sometimes annoyed by sarcasm, the person should not have let themselves be guided by wanting happiness. . . . But it's a double edged sword, as they 'are being guided towards their goal 'by the smile and feeling of happiness. They 'must follow and be guided by the happiness, to an extent.
"being guided purely by emotions means no calculation, and that makes goal less likely to be achieved." But pure calculation means no 'drive perhaps.
SatanLucy R1 Thoughts It's not a 'bad argument, but it might be harmed a bit by wording in the title.
ShtLp R1 Makes the expected argument that SatanLucy's title is different from their argument.
"If emotions are ignored, they play no role. If they are used instrumentally, they are part of the reasoning process." Well, I'm not sure that 'using something, is the same as 'reasoning something.
if goal is not emotional, then a path towards goal cannot be guided by emotions.
"Even if emotions are included in the path, man is not guided by them but uses what logically achieves goal." - SatanLucy The path one walks, is not a guide, one might argue. "When trying to think, reason and calculate to achieve a goal" In Title A path is something one designs to follow, but is to follow a plan, but is a plan a guide? Yes/No, I'm not 'trying to be semantic, Possible SatanLucy should have chosen different words.
"When trying to think, reason and calculate to achieve a goal, man should ignore his emotions and not be guided by them, if he is to achieve his goal, unless goal is being emotional" - Title
So what 'is SatanLucy arguing 'should be the guide? "Calculation"? Reason, Objectivity, Dispassionate. Use of the above to craft a plan, that if necessary one uses emotions, but quickly discards them if the plan calls for it.
ALL ABOVE LEANS ME TOWARDS TIE. If SatanLucy had created debate with two rounds, perhaps they could have said what I said. I mean. . . Arguably they 'did say what I said, just in not so many words, but that is only my interpretation and extrapolation. I think SatanLucy would still need to say it themself.
What leans me towards ShtLp win, is their argument that emotion can play a role in conveying information to oneself, Again, if this wasn't a 1 round debate, SatanLucy could dispute this, but it is 1 round debate. A form of debate that gives strong advantage to person going last. They get final framing and final word, and don't get their argument 'hit any by their opponent.
ShtLp 'does argue emotion is a partial guide on path to a goal, Maybe so, I'm unsure, but passing over.
"Finally, logic alone does not generate goals. It tells you how to achieve them, not what to care about. Most goals are rooted in values, and values are tied to emotional structure." Maybe so, I'm unsure, but passing over. . . . A company or a military complex planning a goal, whose entire purpose is simply to accomplish the goal, to feel emotions other than to accomplish the goal, is to be possibly diverted from the goal. To lose objectivity in planning for accomplishment of the goal.
Conclusion, I don't think the debate was a bait and switch, but I think that ShtLp's arguments are clearer in meaning, easier to grasp and understand clearly what they are saying.
Pro
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