" "If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?" And explain what David meant by "The Lord said to my Lord..." Is the Lord talking to himself?" "
Yes and no.
The Lord know ye he is God is one Lord wasn't talking to his spirit. Scripture says unto the son he said which was God manifest.
Remember, there's the manifest of God, and the spirit of God.
The holy Spirit and the EXPRESSED IMAGE of God.
This is what Stephen saw when he called on God, the one God, so it's deception to say one is not the other, it's the same God . Whether you wanna say the Word, The Father or holy Spirit, the name he called was Lord Jesus. The name Saul was told to call on .
The spirit speaking to the manifestation, the flesh, in this case in heaven would be flesh and bones. At the very least, the manifestation of the flesh.
That's all we can read so that's how we leave it.
" explain what Jesus mean when he says "My Father." Or what does he mean by saying "glorify me…with the glory which I had with you before the world”? And he cannot be glorifying himself because He said "if I glorify myself my glory means nothing." "
I could get deep with this with a layer of scriptures but for the sake of time and plainness, I'll give this scripture that gives the explanation.
You go to John 1 where it says in the beginning was the Word which in the beginning was God, before anything was made that was made , it was God which was spirit.
The spirit became what ...... flesh. The spirit became..... manifest. The spirit conceived the flesh, the son, became the offspring of David first being root. The spirit was manifest to that expressed image.
This coincides making man , God making everything, making man in his image . God didn't have an image before the beginning as such because he's invisible.
But this was the image to come as the scripture says your God shall come I believe.
The spirit spoke and said let their be light. The spirit, the word, was just spirit. So the word being in flesh had to go back up to where he was before. The glory that was emptied out had to return back to the glory that was before the beginning which was spirit. All there was , was one spirit.
From the spirit to flesh back to spirit and also that body given the same glory of immortality which no man has seen nor can see or approach unto, God's glory, whom has not shared with another, who only have immortality dwelling in the light.
This also coincides or lines up with 1 John 1 but I went longer in length then anticipated so I wish to cut it here.
"Also, you take verses that say "by myself" while ignoring ones that say "the Word was with God" and "the glory that I had with you." The "by myself" means God alone, but it doesn't limit it to just the Father. Stop trying to make the Bible contradict itself."
This is something you still haven't got . When you just say the Father, you're also talking about the holy Spirit, you're talking about the word. You still don't get that you don't get one without the other. It's one God. That same God is all the above even if you only mention one of three that bear record. You're the one that thinks just because you only mention one word, it leaves out everything else.
By this logic or point you make, because I don't say God the Father who is love and just say God , is that saying he is not love? I rebuke that.
Every time you read about a subject, you keep in memory alllll the other lines that is in reference to the subject.
It's like you take a verse and just nail it down to an absolute value just by the one verse.
Get into the practice of line upon line.
This is what this trinity doctrine does. It teaches distinction so greatly, you tend to think of the godhead as one without the other just because you only mentioned one title or word.
Totally losing the teaching of 1 John 5 and 7 .
"And let me just check, you don't believe Joseph is the biological father, right? Just the legal father, correct? You don't deny the virgin birth?"
Yes it has to be a virgin birth according to the prophecy. It has to be a virgin birth in order for Jesus to be this holy thing, God.
"Jesus speaks of a Father he has, and it is not Joseph. And tell me why you chose to say that? What other reason did you have if not this? "
I was just being original like I conveyed . Joseph was his father, David was his father. Scripture says out of the fruit of his loins, right. I believe it says that. THE FATHER JESUS is the FATHER of his OWN BODY.
HE LAID IT DOWN AND ROSE IT BACK UP.
"If he is his own father, then your theology contradicts logic and is therefore logically impossible."
Logic has nothing to do with this. I think I've said this over and over. God was before logic,right. This doesn't come by logic. The apostles received revelation. Now if you don't receive it, you don't receive it. I believe Jesus conveyed that if you don't get it, it's not for you to get. It's not by way of your understanding which is what logic operates by. This is supposed to be a spiritual book . Not a logical book. That's where the trinity doctrine came from. It just came by looking at things logically and to make logical sense, oh...."three persons".....to our finite brains...the only way we can possibly understand the godhead is the analogy or equivalence of three persons like us where one is not the other.
But we don't read one is not the other. We read that it is the self same spirit. But wait? How can we understand that? We can't get it because it doesn't fit the natural measure of logic .
RIGHT.... IT'S NOT MEANT TO. UNDERSTANDING ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE DOESN'T COME BY ....LOGIC......IF YOU DON'T GET IT FROM THE SPIRIT.....YOU WILL NOT HAVE UNDERSTANDING.
This is the same error that atheists have. The reason atheists are atheists to the scriptures is because they see the book as like any other trying to look for rationalization and logic.
"Now about Jesus' prayers. I don't understand how you explain it. So you think Jesus prayed to his own spirit? "
Right , Jesus prayed to his own Father which is spirit, his own Father his own Spirit. The spirit of Christ is God.
Don't get this confused with Christ when basically said he commended his spirit. That was the spirit breath of life as it was in Stephen because the spirit goes back to God who gave it. The Creator, the Father.
"When Stephen prayed to Jesus, did he pray to Jesus' body or spirit? "
Both. The body or the man is the mediator.
He called on God , the one who .....created him....the one Father who gave the spirit.
He called him .....LORD JESUS. So in your weak defense, you would have to argue the Lord Jesus created but not Father God which then denies his name as Lord as well as Almighty because then you would of made the point that if the Father didn't create, how can he be Almighty?
Either that or vice versa, Father God created but not the Lord Jesus and then you go against STEPHEN like he got the name mixed up.
You don't have one without the other.
It's the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ. To those who knew God as Jesus came so that they might know the one who sent him according to John 17 manifesting his name ...Lord Jesus...to Stephen....to Thomas.....to Peter....to all those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ ....
All those who know.....knew the name given among men.
Scripture say Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I
Thomas said my LORD and my GOD.
Handling......the LORD JESUS.
WOW.......I wasn't even intending to bring all this in how it lines up.....but ....the scripture teach.....take no thought to what you're going to say.
"Your Nestorianism forces you to divide a person into body and spirit. "
I got bible that says God is a spirit and that flesh and blood.....have not revealed it to you. I don't have to force anything. I can read about one being spirit and one being flesh and blood.
Now you can deny all this and make up another doctrine but it is a curse, it is deception.
"We pray to God as a person, not part of him."
Is his name LORD Jesus?
"Also, when you pray to Jesus, do you pray to his body or spirit?"
Both.
" Do your worship his body or spirit? Or do you do it to his person?"
All of the above. He's my Lord and my God. Like Thomas said. It's my LORD GOD.... PERIOD. So all this trivial stuff about which part..... you're making it about which part because you're stuck in distinctive persons so now you're trying to convert persons to parts.
When is it going to register that it's one Lord God like he said "by myself"?
Scripture emphasizes one over and over and over and over even when it says these three.... still brings it back to one. Just one name.
Scripture teaches his name is one.
Then folks that don't believe in just one Lord counter argue coining the name "oneness" for others that just believe what the scripture emphasizes over and over and over and unto everlasting word.
"Also, how do you make sense of Jesus using pronouns for him and the Father? Like calling himself I/me and the Father you. Pronouns refer to persons, not parts. Do you ever have your body talk to your spirit? Why would Jesus' body talk to his spirit? "
This is easy. Stop or refrain from trying to "make sense" . Jesus spoke many things the apostles did not understand. They didn't make sense of it. Jesus expounded unto them. Jesus is Lord and now the Lord is that spirit so the spirit has to give understanding. These scriptures are what Jesus spoke. If you can't understand them as written, you simply need understanding.
Adding to them is not understanding, it's private interpretation.
I am just about out of character space so in summarizing an answer to the last questions:
The Lord Jesus was God manifest with us made of a woman unto us one God the Father is the Lord Jesus.
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