First post in the religion forum!!

I feel like that's more philosophy than religion, though the line between the two is often blurry. Personally, I'm an ethical non-cognitivist. 

Right, morality is only instituted from one God. Not gods like u said

Just like religion, morality required a human to invent it.

Universe has not morality nor purpose. Only humans apply morality and purpose.

Humans exist to those common things other animals also do, and humans exist to:

1} harvest information,  ---occupied space bits and meta-space mind/intellect/conceptual bits--

2} sort the information into catagories, patterns etc,

3} two winnow out local and cosmic principles,

4} to apply those principles in support to technologies, that  further the standard of living for humans and in support of the ecological environment that sustains humans.

Above Im paraphrasing Bucky Fullers ideas.

Religion is what exists in our meta-space tool box, to aid us getting through our daily lives with the least danger to self and others, in fulfillment of of the most wholistic spiritual teaching, ….all-for-one and one-for-all… as taken from story of Three Musketeers, who were warriors in battle some of the time, if not most of time.

There is another wholistic saying, that, …all I will do for death is to die for it….   H,mm easier said than done.

There there is reality of a dog eat dog world, or as I saw movie doc. about man who stole McDonalds from the McDonald brothers,… its not a dog eat dog world, it is a rat eat rat world…

My mother --raised in deep barefoot country-- liked to say in her later city life with us children, ….its a concrete jungle out there..

Im sure there are plenty of other spiritual teachings out there, perhaps, ….mind your own business and stay out of trouble.. or …keep your head low to avoid loosing it…or etc.

Morality needs some kind of independent referee to keep people from changing the rules. A book written 2,000 years ago whose contents are ubiquitously well known today and which nobody has the power to alter is at least as good as any.

Just like religion, morality required a human to invent it.

That is interesting point. Did morality exist before Adam and Eve existed? Would the lower animals have some moral code established in them? Fro the second question, I don't think so. God gave the breath of life into humans only, and they/us alone carry the responsibility of morals.

For first question, I do believe morality existed before humans. We became the vessel to act on God's moral standards that pre-existed us. Evil existed before we sinned as shown by the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil being present in the Eden story 

That's right.  People's morality don't require the ones of gods. Just require gods to have moralities of gods.

Being that we're talking about biblical context, what do you say morality is?

The scriptures talk about what God is but never puts it as moral. Morality is more of mankind's concept of good and bad .

What do you perceive morality to be?

I agree about man inventing morality.

One thing that is objective is just the do's and don'ts regarding life.

@Mal

Doing right by beings which have rights.

id morality exist before Adam and Eve existed?

Did Adam and Eve have navals?  Did thise first humans on Earth have navals? I guess God was X x and X y, since their made in its image. 

Or were they first humans in Universe?  

 I had a relgiously fundamentalist-type  aunt who could not get her head around the existence of other planets, much less a galaxy full of planets.

So I would ask her about people on those other planets about what Jeus was doing for them, if only existed here. I forget what she said in reply.

Being that we're talking about biblical context, what do you say morality is?

The Oxford American Dictionary does fine as to define morality, but with respect to Biblical context morality is an extension of God's nature established into reality to distinguish standards of good and evil. 

The scriptures talk about what God is but never puts it as moral. Morality is more of mankind's concept of good and bad .

What you're saying is the Scriptures never define God as moral. If you look at what moral means it suits God's nature. If you're saying the Bible never literally says something similar to “God is moral” then I think the next step is to look at the def. of “moral” and see how it applies to God. 

Regarding second sentence, morality is a concept given to mankind by God 

I guess God was X x and X y, since their made in its image.

You are conforming God to you worldly understanding of gender. Gender was instituted by God. That does not mean he is all genders somehow. Although, we reference God as He/Him because He is a personable being and has a relationship with us. 

It's time to rethink why the the Universe exists.

I think that whether or not morality requires God(s) is heavily dependent on what system of morality you are saying exists.

I believe that Aristotelian Virtue Ethics is likely correct, and I find that there isn't anything that necessarily indicates that telos necessarily relies on the existence of the God(s). I know some that hold to a naturalistic view of Aristotelian Virtue Ethics with an evolutionary slant when it comes to the human telos (and thus morality).

But I do think that, given the nature of what morality is under an Aristotelian system, that one could possibly argue that our telos, and thus morality, being as kind and one that does not necessitate suffering could be better explained by it ultimately emanating from the One, and thus the Good (combining Aristotle's ethics with a more Platonic ontology and metaphysics), rather than being entirely coincidental due to naturalism.

But, ultimately, I would agree that Aristotelian Virtue Ethics could exist whether or not theism is true, thus morality does not require God(s).

@FLRW

It's time to rethink why the Universe exists.

The time is 6.25 am.

I just rethought.

And I still don't have a clue.

@PhilosophicalJay

Aristotle was a Greek geezer.

And morality was/is an evolved preferential state of coexistence, albeit somewhat variable.

And survival and coexistence in a overpopulated, overdemanding global society dictates the necessary variability of applied morality.

So perhaps our conscious and subconscious telea are at odds with each other.

Morality needs some kind of independent referee to keep people from changing the rules. A book written 2,000 years ago whose contents are ubiquitously well known today and which nobody has the power to alter is at least as good as any.

But people change the rules of the Bible all the time. Scripture was once understood to condone slavery. Now few adherents understand God to smile upon slavery. The same can be said of matters like gender roles, divorce, and homosexuality. The Bible is under constant renegotiation, and always has been. It is not an independent referee; it's a Rorschach test that people see however they want. Groups decide by common agreement what “the Bible says” and then enforce that socially. But the ultimate authority is the group, not the Bible.

Aristotle was a Greek geezer.

Okay?

morality was/is an evolved preferential state of coexistence

Seems like a big claim to boil it down to mere preference. What justification do you have for this view?

https://www.debatecraft.com/forum/religion/posts/9/first-post-in-the-religion-forum your #5

Ya'll need more than a tool box to carry religion, let alone the idea that Dumas, created "all for one and one for all." It's a concept that was relevant well before the early 17th century. More like the Old Kingdom of ancient Egypt, along with “due process.” 

I think you're right. Morality shouldn't depend on any kind of religion. We could take some principles from the religions that we consider it's good, but in the end morality should only depend on the outcomes we have had throughout our history.

Just take a Christian doctrine that is considered barabaric today, like punishing homoxuals. This would be unacceptable by our current morality. Or women relagated to a secondary role in our society, believe it or not there are some Christian churches that encourage such stupid doctrine.

Find your God and start worshipping him..

Isn't God in God prison for poor design?

Where does it say God is in prison for poor design?

In my mind.

Science is the ultimate referee

Of morality? Yeah, no, I doubt that. Ethics are a metaphysical construct, which science has no way of measuring.

It's measured in survival statistics. All morality and ethics are derivatives of survival traits. Scientifically measured with no need for hocus pocus.

Though I wouldn't say that ethics can’t be dressed up in metaphysics, it’s that it's not a requirement.