What led you to your beliefs?

"I could very easily alter my belief system to make it coherent, but that’s not an honest evaluation of reality, that’s just me picking and choosing what I want to believe then figuring out how to justify it." #28 Double_R

Hm,

When someone holds a strong belief, it seems reasonable to me that the belief is modified for a time until it becomes unlikely or untenable.

Long held ingrained theory seems the most obvious conclusion, so first one modifies one's most obvious theory.

If someone tells me they left the broom in the supply closet,

I may form a theory that the broom is in the supply closet, sub theory that it is on the specific broom hook that has the words broom over it,

Because that is where the broom goes, I have seen it there before, placed it there other times.

I go to the supply closet and do not see the broom on the broom hook.

Should a person discount their first theory of the broom being in the supply closet?

New theory emerging that the person has lied?

Maybe,

Some people are more or less trusting, some people more or less trusted than other people.

But it seems to me a reasonable reaction to first look around the supply closet, to see if the friend placed it somewhere other than the hook.

Even the theory that the friend 'put it in the supply closet may be true, maybe someone else removed it.

I am almost 99% certain I made that argument when I was there in 2019 or 2018

Debate.org wasn’t even functioning by 2018 genius.

Regardless, I stopped using the site back towards the end of 2016, well after I turned atheist, so nice try.

When someone holds a strong belief, it seems reasonable to me that the belief is modified for a time until it becomes unlikely or untenable.

Long held ingrained theory seems the most obvious conclusion, so first one modifies one's most obvious theory.

That doesn’t work here because it wasn’t a strongly held belief. As I explained, the reason this single moment resonated with me and is what I credit as the catalyst to me changing my views is that deep down I already didn’t believe it. I refused to face my beliefs because I feared them, as religion teaches us to do. Once that fear was lifted off of me, I could no longer pretend any of this made sense. At that point I started debating religion and watching religious debates and all of that only entrenched my position further.

How did the change of faith influence other connected beliefs?

Morality?

Afterlife?

Souls?

Consciousness?

Meaning?

Human value?

Other?

Regardless, I stopped using the site back towards the end of 2016, well after I turned atheist, so nice try.

I know that you have a habit of lying, but still, that does not make me feel better.

It turned him into an atheist.

How did the change of faith influence other connected beliefs?

Morality?

Afterlife?

Souls?

Consciousness?

Meaning?

Human value?

Other?

Afterlife, souls, and consciousness obviously changed, but that’s more technical. The rest didn’t change at all in principal, it just became clearer to me where they were coming from. Instead of just accepting for example that something is good because the Bible says so, I was freed to think about why I actually feel the way I do and where we get our moral systems from.

Letting go of my religious predilections gave me a sense of clarity and confidence in myself. I know who I am now way better than I ever did before.

I really wonder what and why you believe.

Life experiences > via 5 senses and access toe meta-space mind/intellect/concept and ego ergo logical, common sense critical thinking.

...{ O . . O }.... bilateral consciousness pathway of most animals

....{ ^ . . ^ }... access to more complex meta-space mind/intellect/concepts and ego via human animal

AI = meta-space coding with ability to search rapidly largest data base of information acquired via humans access to meta-space mind/intellect/concepts.

Absolute

Relative

False

I really wonder what and why you believe.

Happy to expand if there's anything you feel I didn't address

How can your statement be true”Letting go of my religious predilections gave me a sense of clarity and confidence in myself. I know who I am now way better than I ever did before.” when you declare you are unknown to yourself?

What I declared was that I *was* unknown to myself. I'm not anymore.

The reason letting go of religion provided me this is because up until that point, large swaths of who I was as a person was entangled with a belief system that was artificially inseminated into me and for which I was told I was basically not allowed to question.

Why is murder wrong? Because God says so. Don't question God, therefore don't question why murder is wrong, just accept it.

What is my purpose in life? My purpose is whatever God has decided it to be. I can have desires, but only God can approve of them and don't question why.

In essence, I lived my life as a subordinate following instructions. Getting to know myself required me to question myself deep down, to challenge the things I was taught but when that means challenging God's word... that was of limits.

It wasn't letting go of religion itself that gave me the sense I talk about today, that was just the event that removed the road blocks. From there I did the work and continue to this day. It's why I come here.

What was your username on DDO?

How is it possible that you don't know that is "Best Korea"?

He is a stranger to himself and a fake to everyone else.

What do you consider yourself now?

Atheist? Agnostic? Other?

Believe in

Objective morality?

Souls?

Even if technical, I'm curious.

Observation in this reality has led me to my current beliefs. Spare me all the alternate reality BS. This is the one that I see and perceive, all the rest if in fact they do exist, I have no conscious knowledge of them. You will get no other responses from other me's in other realities.

How is it possible that you don't know that is "Best Korea"?

He said DDO, not DART.

How is it possible that you don't know that is "Best Korea"?

Best Korea was a weirdo who played every side of the fence, SatanLucy is much more focused, and BK definitely wasn't a presuppositionalist from what I saw.

I have no problem accepting that they're the same person, neither of which were impressive debaters, but they're personas seem quite different.

How is it possible that you don't know that is "Best Korea"?

He said DDO, not DART.

Good point, they all run together.

Are they good or poor examples of A.I. users?

Just glanced skimmed through various journals of mine physical and digital ones,

2013 to now.

THERE WAS A LOT!

Looks like I read for the first time a 'lot of philosophy books after I joined the military.

Plato, Camus, Machiavelli, Mencius, Confucious, Marcus Aurelius, Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl

Read lot of books about history events and people,

Nuremberg, American Civil War, China Cultural Revolution, Trotsky, Iran Dictatorships, WW2, Rwanda (Shake Hands with the Devil)

Fiction,

I remember I read the Sea Wolf for the first time, and was struck with how my own original thoughts were in the book. Connected with them.

Reread Crime and Punishment,

Read Candide by Voltaire.

More than what is mentioned.

Also sank more into Nihilism,

I recall I debated that 3 or 6 times on DDO,

Resulting in viewing all morality a bit indifferently, one path as good as another.

But one is human, and cares and settles on paths,

Even found around the time I joined Debate.org 16Nov2017,

There's a page in my notebook where I talk about how I've been thinking of joining the site, but worried about failing in debates or looking stupid.

Some 6 months later, another notebook page where I muse on how much my beliefs have changed.

Though I think it was more due to picking labels and vocalizing my thoughts, taking sides.

Early on my profile stated I was a flip flopper on Theism vs Atheism,

By 2018, I think I had settled on Atheist.

It occurs to me that as one labels themself, they solidify in that position, knee jerk agree with their label maybe,

Though even back in 2013, I have pages talking about my doubts in God,

But furthest back notes, I appear to still believe in God, I'm just not 'practicing or worshipping him, I'd already leaned towards Egoism and Selfishness.

But then again, 12Jan2018, I mention a horrible sensation of feeling close to God. Some experience or interaction triggering it. Followed by pain and aversion, and a intentional turning away by myself and ignoring of it.

2017 I mention on how much I dislike the Anti-Theists on DDO,

Some months or years later I talk of how much I value politeness.

I think my loss of religion resulted in my being more tribalistic.

Was also a lot going on in America on the news after I joined, well, always 'something going on I suppose,

I remember Ferguson being on the news in 2014.

I see frequent fears in my notebook 2013 and on about fearing being wrong or looking foolish.

Possibly due to my Dad, possibly due to loss of religion and fearing being wrong again? (Shrug)

2020 in a PM on DDO I state,

"I do not believe in the Christian God, or any afterlife."

20??

I noted my surprise at Trump first presidency,

Some point after he took office, I made some note on my dislike of politics and or media misrepresenting him in my view.

Military might have also pushed me more right.

20??

I muse on why aren't there more criminals?

I 'mean 'it when I say I was a bit crazy back then and selfish, though not 'acting evilly,

I had a 'great desire for enormous power and a longer life,

Surely I thought, people are capable of getting away with crime, why 'don't they commit it then?

Of course now I can see more reasons not to, and now 'feel various reasons not to.

And even then I had and felt some reasons,

But it confused me that if there was no punishment beyond Earth, why don't more people commit crime?

20??

One past thought I've forgotten, spoke on my doubt that I could ever fully 'not believe in God.

And there is truth to that, once I was a theist with some doubts,

Now, even now, though I am an Atheist, I am not free of doubts of God or an after,

Still, I feel sure enough, comfortable enough, that I label myself an Atheist, 'act as one doubtful of God or an after.

MORE NOT MENTIONED

But one only has so much time or willingness to muse on past thoughts,

And I muse on the difficulty of seeing oneself and one's journey through life.

Perhaps if I had different more structured journals, methods, or reviews.

Or the ability to control f my paper ones for search words.

Maybe if one spent each day rereading X amount and meditating or writing 2nd books with each notebook to better explain on old thoughts.

(Shrug)

What do you consider yourself now?

Atheist? Agnostic? Other?

Believe in

Objective morality?

Souls?

Even if technical, I'm curious.

Atheist. My full position is that whatever lies beyond this universe, if anything at all, is unknowable and therefore not worthy of serious consideration beyond the exercise of imagination.

I believe in embracing reason and critical thinking, which leads to the conclusion that the most rational approach is to begin only with what is necessary and work from there. So I exist, my senses are reliable, my reasoning faculties work, etc.

Based on that... the universe exists, that I know because I live within it, and any argument that could possibly be formed to explain how it got here could apply to it as well. So if there has to be an uncaused cause, the universe itself could be that cause. Going back any further doesn't solve anything, it only pushes the problem back a step further except that it does so with unnecessary assumptions.

You might think this sounds more like agnosticism, but agnosticism isn't some middle ground between theism and atheism, agnosticism addresses knowledge, which is a different question from what do you believe.

So do I believe in souls? No, for the same reasons. Our conciseness clearly comes from the physical, that's what we observe. Anything beyond that is just pure assumptions, which are irrational.

Morality - will always be subjective ultimately. You can have objective moral determinations, but any moral determination requires a standard, and the standard itself will always be subjectively chosen, including God even if he exists.

Best Korea was a weirdo who played every side of the fence

Its not nice to call other people weirdos.

How is it possible that you don't know that is "Best Korea"?

All things are possible. Average person considers himself law obeying citizen, but also average person breaks law 3 times a day. We live in a silly world of fun and pretend.

Its not nice to call other people weirdos.

Since you take such pride in being a weirdo, I would think you would take it as a compliment.

Since you take such pride in being a weirdo, I would think you would take it as a compliment.

I dont take pride in being a weirdo. I dont even consider myself weird.

Since you take such pride in being a weirdo, I would think you would take it as a compliment.

I dont take pride in being a weirdo. I dont even consider myself weird.

That is really weird.

Without going into much detail, I started a meditation practice. This led me to witchcraft, which led me to paganism, which led me to spiritualism. You can stick animism in there too.

That’s progress into degradation. How low do you plan to go after animalism.

Well, i'm never going to be a monotheist. So I can't hit rock bottom.

When you hit rock bottom, it's important to be compassionate, seek support, and focus on taking small, manageable steps to rebuild. Prioritize self-care by getting adequate sleep and nutrition, and allow yourself time to process your feelings instead of running from them. If possible, seek professional help from a therapist or support group, but in the meantime, focus on what you can control and start with small, daily habits.