So there's a 2 out of 7 chance scum just got one or more characters on their fake claim list crossed off with those two flips. Odds are still good that if we press someone for a claim it could put scum on the spot. And this time, we need to be sure that whoever we decide to lynch we get a character claim from.
Bring the fucking like button back to mafia, you fun-killing fascists.
Maybe I have just played too much mafia at this point. My snap reaction I think the first time I read that post was "oh, they are a PR or baiting as a PR."
Which I get either. PGO has a reason to bait as a PR to kill people targeting them while a vanilla has reason to bait the kill pretending to be a PR if they understand how the game works.
I am certainly a little paranoid about Wryly but I struggle to believe someone can not re-read that D1 post and recognize a PR potential. Lets look at the post-
Everyone, please note where it says that scum were given 4 character claims and don't know which two are in the game. Even if you are SOP claiming, please hold off on claiming your character until we can all decide if it's necessary. And in general, everyone should be more hesitant to claim their characters this time around, even if you think the connection to the role isn't obvious (mine certainly isn't).
Note the last bit. "even if you think the connection to the role isn't obvious (mine certainly isn't)."
This screams "I am a PR" in the very most basic way and is like the first post in the thread. Saying they did not recognize it is one thing. Acting like its not super obvious and scummy looks more like painting people as scum than scum hunting. Its just such an absurd thought process I do not really connect with it. While I have suspected both Wryly and Banana so far it would be an odd move for a scum team to both punch the same talking point so directly here. Could be that they just got done in a scum chat and decided on a push but I am thinking about how such a team would reach such a decision.
To overexplain again (just doing my challenge) if a S! Banana and S! Wryly were teamed and they were in a D2 where they could win D3 after shoving a hammer such an aligned push this early makes little sense. If I was scum I would basically shut the fuck up and let the game be dead right now. Much less coordinate a push with my team mate.
Then Wryly did not seem to have a hard take on Thoth but voted while Banana had a position that Thoth was scum in 183 yet they voted off train. Could be TMI Banana? Maybe they are framing my recognizing WF as a PR as scummy as well to paint as they distance from the issue and pushing TvT situations? This kinda makes more sense to me than them being directly aligned which puts Wryly and Banana into more of a TvW than a WvW situation if that makes sense. But in pretty much every situation I do still suspect one or the other is creating the narrative or capitalizing on it.
Granted I do have my bias. I feel its stupid obvious that post screamed "I am a power role" but while I just pick things up without thinking Wryly saying its unreasonable to pick up on that feels truly absurd to me. With it being pointed out I figure everyone should recognize they essentially soft claimed a PR right there. While Banana's D1 looks worse than Wryly's I do have to say that Wryly's position seems more unreasonable than the question Banana posited.
Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/7/2026 at 12:53 AM (post #31)
So there's a 2 out of 7 chance scum just got one or more characters on their fake claim list crossed off with those two flips. Odds are still good that if we press someone for a claim it could put scum on the spot. And this time, we need to be sure that whoever we decide to lynch we get a character claim from.
Was this a TMI slip?
Do you have a finite amount of films in the list to know what is possible that you can explain? This seems like a very strange assertion
(Again to over explain)
For Wryly to take the logic jump to say its specifically 2/7 chance of a fake claim list getting removed it would suggest they know what the odds of included movies are. I did glance through D1 on what Jim Carry films existed and it was a total mess. A ton were cameos and weird support role projects. Even roughly skimming the top films I rarely found a role that was a 'good guy' or a 'bad guy' or anything else I could see as a split.
My thinking here boils down to how it would be remotely possible to designate the ratio of a fake claim list without more information than I was given as a player. This is a red flag.
VTL: Wryly
I think there is a scum between Banana vs Wryly. I think this just looks like Wryly is it capitalizing on Banana's position.
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/6/2026 at 11:19 PM (post #28)
I am not sure what else someone could have taken other than they are a PR. If I was scum it would have motivated me to kill them but putting on a scum hat to break down what I would think; them being some PR would be a lesser focus because a critical role would be more subtle at their skill level. They eneded up being a potentially damaging role to town but I figured someone would recognize the openly voiced claim there.
Like, they were obviously outing themselves to the point I would have been paranoid that they were a vet/pgo or something if I was scum. The scum taking that kill shows either ignorance on their part reading players as well as reading the collective opinion of the town or it suggest they had some way to ensure their move went through.
We should circle back to WF's reads. They were open in their thoughts.
that seems like a pretty big leap, and im struggling to find why town would look into something like that as much as scum would
boop!
helz seems a bit over defensive and omgussy for my taste. hmm will have to think on this. im willing to wait for more ppl to chime in tho, interested in seeing if anyone else thinks that wf was an obvious pr from that statement.
boop!
Originally Posted by Banana on 11/7/2026 at 1:26 AM (post #35)
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/6/2026 at 11:19 PM (post #28)
I am not sure what else someone could have taken other than they are a PR. If I was scum it would have motivated me to kill them but putting on a scum hat to break down what I would think; them being some PR would be a lesser focus because a critical role would be more subtle at their skill level. They eneded up being a potentially damaging role to town but I figured someone would recognize the openly voiced claim there.
Like, they were obviously outing themselves to the point I would have been paranoid that they were a vet/pgo or something if I was scum. The scum taking that kill shows either ignorance on their part reading players as well as reading the collective opinion of the town or it suggest they had some way to ensure their move went through.
We should circle back to WF's reads. They were open in their thoughts.
that seems like a pretty big leap, and im struggling to find why town would look into something like that as much as scum would
First post of the game I ended up reading over and over. I am not sure how other people did not see that potential immediately.
Would I as scum be so open about recognizing it right after they were killed? What sense does that make?
People playing dumb looking at it after the fact should see it as obvious at the very least even if it makes me a mafia snob for arguing how obvious I felt it was. But really, I get you thinking scum would PR hunt and town would be less inclined. I feel you should consider my experience picking up on the post but let me directly ask you- What do you think about Wryly saying its not even something not even reasonable to be seen after the fact? I feel thats kinda nuts. I can get overlooking the obvious indicator but saying that its unreasonable for someone to even recognize such a thing is wild before you consider how stupid it would be for someone to kill a slot then make a case for how they could have motive to kill them.
I would like your opinion on Wryly and their weird certainty of a specific ratio of claims to make a ratio as well as their opinion that post flip they do not see PR flagging.
Maybe. I just have very limited time. Will be gone for like the next 24 hours and I am not happy with how the game is going. I want to shove somewhere and get this rolling so we do not have another apathetic D1. I will remind everyone that a no-lynch gives the town another day as well. While I really think I am onto something with Wryly / Banana I do think we should consider this before just fumbling down some road because there is no better option which looks like how D1 went.
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 2:16 AM (post #33)
Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/7/2026 at 12:53 AM (post #31)
So there's a 2 out of 7 chance scum just got one or more characters on their fake claim list crossed off with those two flips. Odds are still good that if we press someone for a claim it could put scum on the spot. And this time, we need to be sure that whoever we decide to lynch we get a character claim from.
Was this a TMI slip?
Do you have a finite amount of films in the list to know what is possible that you can explain? This seems like a very strange assertion
(Again to over explain)
For Wryly to take the logic jump to say its specifically 2/7 chance of a fake claim list getting removed it would suggest they know what the odds of included movies are. I did glance through D1 on what Jim Carry films existed and it was a total mess. A ton were cameos and weird support role projects. Even roughly skimming the top films I rarely found a role that was a 'good guy' or a 'bad guy' or anything else I could see as a split.
My thinking here boils down to how it would be remotely possible to designate the ratio of a fake claim list without more information than I was given as a player. This is a red flag.
There were 7 town players and 2 just flipped, so there is a 2 out of 7 chance they were on the fake claim list Lunatic gave scum. I suppose it might be more accurate to say they each had a 1 out of 7 chance of being on the list, but what have you.
Bring the fucking like button back to mafia, you fun-killing fascists.
Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/7/2026 at 1:48 AM (post #39)
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 2:16 AM (post #33)
Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/7/2026 at 12:53 AM (post #31)
So there's a 2 out of 7 chance scum just got one or more characters on their fake claim list crossed off with those two flips. Odds are still good that if we press someone for a claim it could put scum on the spot. And this time, we need to be sure that whoever we decide to lynch we get a character claim from.
Was this a TMI slip?
Do you have a finite amount of films in the list to know what is possible that you can explain? This seems like a very strange assertion
(Again to over explain)
For Wryly to take the logic jump to say its specifically 2/7 chance of a fake claim list getting removed it would suggest they know what the odds of included movies are. I did glance through D1 on what Jim Carry films existed and it was a total mess. A ton were cameos and weird support role projects. Even roughly skimming the top films I rarely found a role that was a 'good guy' or a 'bad guy' or anything else I could see as a split.
My thinking here boils down to how it would be remotely possible to designate the ratio of a fake claim list without more information than I was given as a player. This is a red flag.
There were 7 town players and 2 just flipped, so there is a 2 out of 7 chance they were on the fake claim list Lunatic gave scum. I suppose it might be more accurate to say they each had a 1 out of 7 chance of being on the list, but what have you.
Why 7/2?
Jim Carry has been in 57 films. If I were to quantify the likelihood of the anticlaim being touched before considering the films he was in and what would be valid for something in this game it would not be that simple targeting flavor. You are behaving as if you thought he only acted in as many films as we have players which makes me wonder if you got some sorta list of what films exist that I did not.
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 12:38 AM (post #38)
Maybe. I just have very limited time. Will be gone for like the next 24 hours and I am not happy with how the game is going. I want to shove somewhere and get this rolling so we do not have another apathetic D1. I will remind everyone that a no-lynch gives the town another day as well. While I really think I am onto something with Wryly / Banana I do think we should consider this before just fumbling down some road because there is no better option which looks like how D1 went.
so your theory behind me and wryly being a scum team is blatant teaming and not even trying to hide it? also u realize neither of us voted you right? i just pointed out something that seemed suspicious to me is all, wasnt an iron clad case. ur reaction to it is more suspicious than the initial thing ever was. also neither of us even voted you and wrylys comment on it was way lesser than mine, she more or less admitted only that she didnt see the "power role" thing either. you painting us as a scum team over that just seems a bit over reactionary to me.
boop!
I think Helz being defensive and myopic about details is NAI, but I'll need to read his posts more thoroughly in the morning and respond properly.
Bring the fucking like button back to mafia, you fun-killing fascists.
Originally Posted by Banana on 11/7/2026 at 1:57 AM (post #41)
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 12:38 AM (post #38)
Maybe. I just have very limited time. Will be gone for like the next 24 hours and I am not happy with how the game is going. I want to shove somewhere and get this rolling so we do not have another apathetic D1. I will remind everyone that a no-lynch gives the town another day as well. While I really think I am onto something with Wryly / Banana I do think we should consider this before just fumbling down some road because there is no better option which looks like how D1 went.
so your theory behind me and wryly being a scum team is blatant teaming and not even trying to hide it? also u realize neither of us voted you right? i just pointed out something that seemed suspicious to me is all, wasnt an iron clad case. ur reaction to it is more suspicious than the initial thing ever was. also neither of us even voted you and wrylys comment on it was way lesser than mine, she more or less admitted only that she didnt see the "power role" thing either. you painting us as a scum team over that just seems a bit over reactionary to me.
You are either reading what I said poorly or I said things poorly. I literally argued that you are not W/W and that you are likely T/W. May want to go back and revisit my words.
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 2:57 AM (post #40)
Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/7/2026 at 1:48 AM (post #39)
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 2:16 AM (post #33)
Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/7/2026 at 12:53 AM (post #31)
So there's a 2 out of 7 chance scum just got one or more characters on their fake claim list crossed off with those two flips. Odds are still good that if we press someone for a claim it could put scum on the spot. And this time, we need to be sure that whoever we decide to lynch we get a character claim from.
Was this a TMI slip?
Do you have a finite amount of films in the list to know what is possible that you can explain? This seems like a very strange assertion
(Again to over explain)
For Wryly to take the logic jump to say its specifically 2/7 chance of a fake claim list getting removed it would suggest they know what the odds of included movies are. I did glance through D1 on what Jim Carry films existed and it was a total mess. A ton were cameos and weird support role projects. Even roughly skimming the top films I rarely found a role that was a 'good guy' or a 'bad guy' or anything else I could see as a split.
My thinking here boils down to how it would be remotely possible to designate the ratio of a fake claim list without more information than I was given as a player. This is a red flag.
There were 7 town players and 2 just flipped, so there is a 2 out of 7 chance they were on the fake claim list Lunatic gave scum. I suppose it might be more accurate to say they each had a 1 out of 7 chance of being on the list, but what have you.
Why 7/2?
Jim Carry has been in 57 films. If I were to quantify the likelihood of the anticlaim being touched before considering the films he was in and what would be valid for something in this game it would not be that simple targeting flavor. You are behaving as if you thought he only acted in as many films as we have players which makes me wonder if you got some sorta list of what films exist that I did not.
Scum were given a list of 4 characters, 2 of which are already in the game and 2 of which are not. They need to know which 2 of the 4 are already in the game, and Thoth and whiteflame's flips have a 2 out of 7 chance of helping them toward that goal.
Bring the fucking like button back to mafia, you fun-killing fascists.
I will have very limited participation over the next 24 hours but please- lets not have another D1. Lets shove people and fight to get reads. We are on a bad path and I have concerns about the NK and the D1 lynch.
Sunday I will be able to dive in with both hands and interact. Lets push though. The gamestate looks awful for us
I am not following.
Scum were given 4 characters with 2 being in the game. Sure.
From an actor with 57 films. How is that not 2 out of 57 chance of helping them?
Side question for others- Do scum typically get a list of whats possible on this site?
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 3:11 AM (post #46)
I am not following.
Scum were given 4 characters with 2 being in the game. Sure.
From an actor with 57 films. How is that not 2 out of 57 chance of helping them?
They could definitely just make up their own fake characters from any of his movies, but if they can eliminate the two real characters from the list they get two fake claims they know are safe.
Bring the fucking like button back to mafia, you fun-killing fascists.
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 1:04 AM (post #43)
Originally Posted by Banana on 11/7/2026 at 1:57 AM (post #41)
Originally Posted by Helz on 11/7/2026 at 12:38 AM (post #38)
Maybe. I just have very limited time. Will be gone for like the next 24 hours and I am not happy with how the game is going. I want to shove somewhere and get this rolling so we do not have another apathetic D1. I will remind everyone that a no-lynch gives the town another day as well. While I really think I am onto something with Wryly / Banana I do think we should consider this before just fumbling down some road because there is no better option which looks like how D1 went.
so your theory behind me and wryly being a scum team is blatant teaming and not even trying to hide it? also u realize neither of us voted you right? i just pointed out something that seemed suspicious to me is all, wasnt an iron clad case. ur reaction to it is more suspicious than the initial thing ever was. also neither of us even voted you and wrylys comment on it was way lesser than mine, she more or less admitted only that she didnt see the "power role" thing either. you painting us as a scum team over that just seems a bit over reactionary to me.
You are either reading what I said poorly or I said things poorly. I literally argued that you are not W/W and that you are likely T/W. May want to go back and revisit my words.
"To overexplain again (just doing my challenge) if a S! Banana and S! Wryly were teamed and they were in a D2 where they could win D3 after shoving a hammer such an aligned push this early makes little sense. If I was scum I would basically shut the fuck up and let the game be dead right now. Much less coordinate a push with my team mate."
maybe i misread but thats the part i thought you were saying we were scum paired
boop!
Originally Posted by wylted on 11/7/2026 at 6:40 AM (post #52)
I have concerns about the NK and the D1 lynch.
nope, you don't get to have concerns when you refused to place a vote on anyone else making any other lynch impossible to secure
Nah. In my 3 posts D1 I said more than you did in all your activity D1. I knew I would not have the time those days or today which is why I reserved and I was clear about that.
Hell, As I keep pointing out I still have no clue what your reads are on players. So eh, what are your reads on players and why anyways?
Originally Posted by wylted on 11/7/2026 at 6:43 AM (post #53)
is helz sophisticated enough to pretend he didn't see dp1 op and overlooked every discussion this far of pie giving scum 4 claims 2 of which are safe and 2 unsafe and not telling them which is which?
also I suspect scum are his shittiest movies like sunshine of the eternal mind ..
also to claim he was never the bad guy in any is bullshit. he was the bad guy in all the sonic the hedgehog movies and arguably also in the moving man in the moon about Andy Kaufman who was publicly and notoriously an asshole while maintaining a mcdonalds career to stay level headed.
I do not know what you are getting at here but you are misrepresenting my words.
Yes I understand the anti-claim mechanic exists. What I do not understand is that really weird figure you voiced like you had been given a different list of flavor than me. I am town and I know what others should know. I do in fact pay critical attention to that sort of thing and what you voiced looked a bit like TMI. That I am not super hardline dedicated on. (Although its really weird you grab one of the only flips and point to it like it could be the scum movie. Either hypocritical or you are feigning ignorance here given what you said in this exact post)
And re-read my words. I voiced that the majority of Jim Carrys films he is not clearly a good or bad guy. I do not want to coach scum here but just consider one of his more popular movies
Fun with Dick and Jane. Dude is some scumbag executive working for a large corporation and gets laid off. Then turns around and starts a life of crime to support his lifestyle like a piece of shit. In the end he takes down the big bad CEO of the ugly company. I could not begin to say if that makes him good or evil.
Go though his movies and its the typical trend. Him being an awful person but doing 'something' moral at some point. Then look at the flips. Eternal Sunshine and Yes Man. Neither seem to me like he is a good or bad guy. I absolutely never claimed he was never the bad guy. Off the top of my head consider Batman Forever, The Cable guy, or The Grinch. I did say I am struggling to see what the split is given the ambiguity of the overwhelming majority of his roles. He is typically an eccentric piece of shit of a person in his films even when he has some life learning bit in the end or he ends up doing one thing right.
(again, because I am obligated to over explain everything)
If I consider the dude has 57 films and the Anti-claim is 4 films with 2 already existing in the game its kinda useless which I voiced D1. While I am not opposed to flavor hunting I simply do not see logic in it with the information we have. You pushing that people need to give flavor is weird to me and feels like scum nervous about getting screwed by making a bad claim.
I hope others look into you. I will simply summarize my feelings on you-
I dislike that you are so inconsistent about flavor. You started D1 discounting it and then progressed to unpacking it and pushing for it. Now although you were so seemingly focused on it you look like you are faking ignorance referencing a flipped town flavor as a potential scum flavor. (I would encourage everyone to look through their D1 #3, #16, #28 for that progression.)
The odds you threw out are super weird and makes me question if you were given information I was not. It really looks that way to me. Its such a strange assertion to ignore the amount of films Jim Carry was in and replace it with the figure of the amount of players that it looks very much like a TMI logic jump.
I dislike that you seemed like you had TMI on Rex in 77 and the following logic. The logic jump to instead of focusing on their specific meta you focus on site meta is odd given its such a player specific focus. While site meta has its uses I woulda expected to see more of a "Look at Rex did here" sorta mind set than a "Well has this happened on the site" mindset. To be more specific The prior I absolutely expect 100% with the second bit being a supporting consideration. Ignoring individual meta while arguing site meta just seems as unnatural to me as assuming the player base is the entire cap of movies that exist. I do not follow the thought process.
I very much do not like how active you are and how little I understand your positions. I did Iso you last night and basically viewed you as slightly town leaning Banana and having a hard town position on Rex. Ehh... Ok.. So how about everyone else? You can be critical of my participation but I have an entire life and companies to run. With the little time I had I gave everything I could and made many specific original points. Shading me misrepresenting my posts then saying "We should lynch a lurker" I feel you are in that pool man.
Allow me to quote what I feel was your most substantial post of D1-
Ah, Pie already said like Masons for instance. Hadn't reread that far.
Aside from Rex and Thoth, basically all I have to go on for anyone else is vibes, and I really hate going on vibes. I always sus whiteflame and Pie, so I don't trust my gut on either of them. There's not much to go on for Helz or Mago, and wylted is eh. I have a good feeling about Nana but I always have a good feeling about Nana.
This has to be one of the most non-committal read lists I have ever seen. Yes it is still D1. But that is a word salad of "I think this but I dont" backtracking in 1 post.
I have 5 meetings today. That is a lot even for me so I will not be around much. I do not do the phone posting thing. But I am unhappy with the overall direction of the game and wanted to put in the leg work to create some starting point when I jumped in and saw how dead we were going into D2. I will make it a point to be very active Sunday. Expect little from me in the next 12 hours or so but consider my words. Wryly looks bad to me. I need to dig back through Banana and we need to get Mag to engage. I am not sure if we can afford a policy lynch but they have to be shoved to jump in.
Originally Posted by Banana on 11/7/2026 at 9:16 AM (post #56)
Originally Posted by wylted on 11/7/2026 at 7:17 AM (post #55)
somebody give me a post count of everyone up until this point in page 2.
wryly- 79
wylted- 39
thoth- 39
wf- 34
banana-32
pie- 24
helz- 22
rex- 19
mago- 10
Hmm. Highest post count and I have the lowest understanding of what their reads are out of anyone but the lowest post count. Wild
WF kill is not odd at all. Midgame scum want to control and influence the DP. WF is a prolific poster and good at dominating conversation. Only argument against killing him is that any watcher worth their salt would be watching either him or Pie NP1, as those are the two obvious kills.
"Human kind cannot bear very much reality."
T. S. Eliot
