Suikoden Mafia

I think it was that split. He just interpreted Joshua as empire. I mentioned he was. It was just an odd claim from the rest.

Looking at the flip, specifically how REF has openly stated that Joshua and Leon were not part of the Empire, and how he outright stated that he didn't view my fake claim as inherently sus, I disagree. However, I'll let REF explain the theme split because I can't figure it out.

Interested in that as well. He told me windy also could not be considered part of the empire. Could have been people who served barbosa which is still in a way part of the empire

joshua served him in the succession war and then abandoned him. I am interested to see the split as well

I actually do not fault them for foregoing the recruit NP1, I probably would have done the same. But making that decision necessitated that they play DP2 as cautiously as possible and to above all else avoid Thoth getting lynched. They did the exact opposite of that.

I never had faith in the leprechaun claim, and I voiced it multiple times, I don't know why he was so committed to it. But yeah I think it would have looked scummy if I didn't bus him there anyway, because town me would have suspected that claim hella.

The reason I didn’t SoP hated was because I couldn’t get an answer on whether or not it goes away at LYLO/MYLO. Wanted to avoid a scenario where I’m just kept alive until the last DP and then quickhammered.

I probably would’ve just grit my teeth and claimed without the Cop ability cause not telling town about the Hated and claiming it later is very sus, but having the cop ability gave me idea to just hide the hated, cop someone NP1, reveal cop results DP2, and then get killed by scum NP2.

By the time I had left the thread and came back, Whiteflame had already submitted a shot at me, so there was no point in claiming there either, and I don’t know how one just predicts all that happening and SoP claims before it does.

To counterclaim Supa was a ballsy but shortsighted move, because it meant as soon as he died you would be on the chopping block.

That was my claim, that was the janitor. For you to call that short sighted you HAVE to admit that it was retarded to put multiple healing roles in the game, and I am not even saying that, you are inferring that by saying I made a dumb decision by using a janitored claim. Makes no sense lol. Means you knew that this would cause some chaos when you designed the game. I am in an uninformed minority, I have no clue what role im janitoring especially from an inactive player who hinted nothing about what he was. Whatever his claim was, was what I was going to have to stick with, and I played it the same way I would have as town.

Split was basically Tir & Mathiu vs everyone, with a 'core' of Empire characters who couldn't be recruited, the Five Generals who could bar one, and a couple of neutrals like Leon and Joshua and of course Yuber as the wildcard. The idea is that in the game you start out as a fugitive and the whole world is against you, and you have to win allies and defeat enemies.

That was my claim, that was the janitor. For you to call that short sighted you HAVE to admit that it was retarded to put multiple healing roles in the game, and I am not even saying that, you are inferring that by saying I made a dumb decision by using a janitored claim. Makes no sense lol. Means you knew that this would cause some chaos when you designed the game. I am in an uninformed minority, I have no clue what role im janitoring especially from an inactive player who hinted nothing about what he was. Whatever his claim was, was what I was going to have to stick with, and I played it the same way I would have as town.

My issue was that you didn't claim the janitored role, which was 1x doc. You claimed straight-up doc, as in 'I can protect someone every night' doc. I feel like if you had claimed 1x doc it would not have been as sus. Even with you claiming full doc Supa in particular was starting to notice how excessive healing roles might be balanced by the extra kills that were possible.

The reason I didn’t SoP hated was because I couldn’t get an answer on whether or not it goes away at LYLO/MYLO. Wanted to avoid a scenario where I’m just kept alive until the last DP and then quickhammered.

I probably would’ve just grit my teeth and claimed without the Cop ability cause not telling town about the Hated and claiming it later is very sus, but having the cop ability gave me idea to just hide the hated, cop someone NP1, reveal cop results DP2, and then get killed by scum NP2.

By the time I had left the thread and came back, Whiteflame had already submitted a shot at me, so there was no point in claiming there either, and I don’t know how one just predicts all that happening and SoP claims before it does.

I thought that you not SOPing hated was smart in this situation. In theory you could have taken that role to mylo/lylo but only if the mafia recruit failed. It was a way to kneecap town and force them to waste a lynch on the cop if mafia got kneecapped with a failed recruit.

My issue was that you didn't claim the janitored role, which was 1x doc. You claimed straight-up doc, as in 'I can protect someone every night' doc. I feel like if you had claimed 1x doc it would not have been as sus. Even with you claiming full doc Supa in particular was starting to notice how excessive healing roles might be balanced by the extra kills that were possible.

As town you always claim you are more than x shot. The balance argument about x shots was already inferred and I did bring this point up to vader.

Page 24, post 694: https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/active-games/posts/1f/suikoden-mafia-dp2?page=24

I obviously with inside knowledge know that most of these roles are 1x and make sense with the balance. Town does not know this. I acted in a way that town would naturally react in this situation, by instantly cc'ing vader which is what I should have done, and easing into the argument that there could be multiple protective roles later on if you consider x shot roles. Remember if I was town I wouldn't know this so I can't just outright come out and assume that he was 1x too.

Anyways, I literally did the thing you are claiming I should have done, but I did it in a more natural way. You might not have read that post, because there were so many posts in the game I can see you skipping it. But I literally did this.

Wasn’t a hard this for that split then. Yeah I would have barked up the wrong tree all game. If it wasn’t a or b it was hard

I am proud I immediately got wf

that I was correct mostly about the split. Outside of 2 characters

and that I got the list of who could be recruited correctly

also very happy I nailed both Sonya as a loved role and that barbosa was aesthetic

was just fun try to and tie the characters to the lore. Sad it didn’t go longer but was a blast

I also thought sonya would be beloved princess based on her wiki

I was actually a perma commuter lol. I just chose to CC Thoth cause it Ascetic is so similar and his Leprechaun claim was garbage

That is big brain

On god didn’t really care to much about how much mafia had or what I was giving away. I was having blast trying to solve.

I def disagreed with some details of characters and roles tied to them. Joshua’s as strengther, 3 protective roles (which tbf these all made sense, and Wylted being able to heal himself

but that’s the fun of it is interpretation. I think I got pretty close given there was no real theme split but the effort and design was great. Loved the pictures and all the effort into the roles. Prob will steal this for my games

I do think scum were largely fucked if they hit and claimed either kwanda or kasim. The 3 protective roles were a lot and someone was going to die cus there are so many.

this actually would have fucked town if they hit anyone else. If they would have landed on any other janitor that inevitable mislynch would have prob been in the favor.

also lol at uber and killing Mharm. Really did think wf was bullshitting on day vig

Rex is almost making it sound like I didn't know that Suikoden is about recruiting the 108 Stars of Destiny, which, whether he meant to or not, is basically insulting me by accusing me of not reading the information he posted in game threads and not looking up the most basic information about the game. Mikal said there were factors that determined which characters were recruitable and that you wouldn't know unless you had played Suikoden. You could say that I should have caught that as a likely attempt to scare scum away from recruiting, but I was thinking that the split happened at an exact time in the game and/or its lore, which fit with it being hard to find by Googling and also fit with other things Mikal said, like post #111 in day 2:

If mathias [Mathiu] is in the game he’s scum lock

there are two scenarios

if tir is scum, Mathias can be in the game and on the scum team

if tir is town. Mathias is prob not in the game at all

I knew I was scum-Mathiu and Tir was my scummate, so this fit with my exact-point-in-time hypothesis. Maybe I should have been more skeptical, but what was I supposed to do, play Suikoden from start to finish just to double-check Mikal?

Rex's calculation (post #25) that I had an 83% chance of hitting a recruitable player has two big problems. First off, I wasn't sure that Kohai was Teo. My guess, which turned out to be right for the wrong reason, was that if Kohai were Teo, since Tir got a bonus when Teo died, Kohai's card would say that he would would either get a bonus when Tir died or that Tir would get a bonus when died, hence why he thought Tir was town. Much more importantly, my card said there was an unspecified character for whom recruitment would kill me and the recruiter. I had no idea that was Teo/Kohai. Even if I agreed with Rex's list of six players who were not clearly unrecruitable, I would not have been sure how many were recruitable, and even if I knew that at least five were recruitable, I still would have been reluctant to risk going boom-boom.

TL;DR of the Leprechaun claim:

>> Rex offered us three questions about characters in the game

>> Then offered to instead give us a fake-claim character

>> Luna and I agreed and got Lepant

>> I had a wild idea of claiming I could redirect the NK

>> A day later, I was playing Werewolf at a party and saw a role called Leprechaun that can move the NK to an adjacent player

>> I thought it was funny that Leprechaun and Lepant both start with Lep (call them lepers)

>> I had wanted to kill Shining or Pie to "prove" my claim because I thought they were sus, and, hilariously, I found out they were both next to Mikal

>> I weakened the role because it seemed OP in a non-open role setup

>> Leprechaun was weird, so I made the justification sound too outrageous to fake-claim

>> I added Ascetic because I was Ascetic

>> I deployed the claim

>> It got the mixed reaction I expected

>> It might have gotten me through DP2 if I had given better answers about how Ascetic worked

Moral of the story: Ask every question you can think of about how your role works, and ask them ahead of time.

4) He said Strongman would move too. That’s anti-thetical to what a Strongman does. Strongman always reaches its intended target

(Day 2, post #270) I thought Juggernaut was a less common name than Strongman for the same ability of overriding protection but not redirection, and I said Strongman in hopes that it might distance me from Tir if his card flipped.

Joshua’s as strengther

This was because when Leknaat tried to counteract Windy's half of the Gate Rune with hers and failed (because her sister was more powerful) Joshua channeled the power of the Dragon Rune to bolster her and allow her to destroy more of the army that her sister had summoned.

Rex is almost making it sound like I didn't know that Suikoden is about recruiting the 108 Stars of Destiny, which, whether he meant to or not, is basically insulting me by accusing me of not reading the information he posted in game threads and not looking up the most basic information about the game. Mikal said there were factors that determined which characters were recruitable and that you wouldn't know unless you had played Suikoden.

I said that you did know this, but you let Mikal scare you away from it with his bullshit.

I can't blame this loss on Luna, but I disagree with instantly calling my claim horseshit. I think he should have gauged reactions and then decided which end of the rainbow to go to.

I said that you did know this, but you let Mikal scare you away from it with his bullshit.

You mean his bullshit that I couldn't have known was bullshit unless I played the game and for which my working hypothesis repeatedly matched other things Mikal was saying?

Tbf im his favor. I did cal the scum team to the character

Don't think you have yet, so when you get a chance, might want to submit the results of this game.

wdym?

also lol at uber and killing Mharm. Really did think wf was bullshitting on day vig

Truly one of occurrences that happened this game.

Drop down menu under "Mafia," click "Submit Game Result" and enter player names and such.

Truly one of occurrences that happened this game.

It certainly did... happen.

Nothing there but the normal four options for me.

Truly one of occurrences that happened this game.

Occurrences happened in this game, to be sure. It was one of the games of all time.