Candace Owens Extended Universe Endgame | Mafia

#1

The setup:

Scum Team:

Fake claims provided:

Nick Fuentes (Character) Tyler Bowyer (Character) Odd-night Watcher (Role)

The scum team was created with the interesting idea of encouraging a bus. Unfortunately, due to RNG the character that was supposed to bus was given to one of the YOLO scum players on the site and the player who was supposed to be bussed was given to one of the most careful. I feel like if the RNG here had been reversed scum would have won this game hands down, because Wryly's scum play was quite good and aside from the Wylted watcher flip I feel like Thoth had set himself up as an ideal mislynch target in the last DP. Have never been more tempted to reroll a game, honestly. Wylted straight-claiming Candace was catastrophic due to the theme split being fairly obvious, and him getting lynched early meant that the one fake role claim they were given would seem sus after his flip.

Scum also played a bit too conservatively with their night actions. There were two points where riskier plays would have paid off big time. They originally intended to lawyer Wryly and leave the cop alive - he actually investigated her and would have gotten an inno if they had done so. They also killed the tracker the same night he investigated Wryly while she used the Ninja and saw her not move. So, leaving these power roles alive would have resulted in two green checks on Wryly.

MVP: Banana

Banana came in clutch in the final DP, and the fact that she got minimal pushback for probably the scummiest town role I have ever designed was testament to how good her play was. I was fully expecting Wryly to win this one because Thoth had set himself up as such a perfect target due to his waffling on lynching Wylted DP2 while Wryly's vote was on him early. Banana put in the work to see through that. Great play, especially given the fact that she was coming back from several rounds of inactivity and replaced in halfway through.

Notes on Balance:

The game was heavy on protective and investigatives for two reasons.

First was to compensate for the lovers. The lovers are a huge benefit to town, because they are town confirmed to one another and can coordinate a doc night action. They can lie about being lovers, they just have to avoid being NKd. I was surprised by their decision to use the NK to protect Luna, I had always expected in simulations for the Lover Doc to use the role to protect the most likely NK target among themselves due to the risk of a double kill if they didn't - if they didn't protect within the Lovers the chance of a double NK was 2/7 - 29%. With the protection it was a 14% of a double kill and a 14% of a no kill which basically erased the negative utility mathematically. On the other hand, the doc being outed DP1 was also not something I expected, so that makes their decision much more understandable.

Second was the powerful range of abilities given to scum which would fuck with investigatives - the redirector, the mirror, the lawyer, the ninja, and the haunt. In a small game these roles could muddle results significantly, especially the mirror. The strengthener also existed to counter these manipulative roles, while they existed in such numbers to give town the ability to analyze and break down a game through analyzing night actions and figure out where people were misdirected or lying.

Night Actions:

NP1:

Wylted: Mirror, Kill WF

Thoth: Rolestop Wylted

Pie: Track Luna

Supa: Doc Luna

Mikal: Mikal submitted his night action as Roleblock this round. I fucked up and didn't realize that he was trying to use his even night role on an odd night, so I told Pie that his action failed before taking that back and giving him his result. I refused to elaborate on this further to Banana because I think it would unfairly role confirm her in Pie's mind if she explained what had actually happened, so I stayed mum. Banana ironically made the same mistake later on.

NP2:

Wylted: Rolecop Pie & kill Luna

Wryly: Redirect Banana to Thoth

Thoth: Commute

Luna: Cop Wryly

Pie: Track Luna

NP3:

Wryly: Ninja kill Pie

Banana: Strengthen Thoth

Pie: Track Wryly

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The setup: Scum Team:<img src="https://debatecraft.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/6e42f09e-0dd7-41e9-ab78-96b67e4bf181.png" /><img src="https://debatecraft.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/a886d4a1-8400-461f-bcab-fc30d1ab91ee.png" /> Fake claims provided:Nick Fuentes (Character) Tyler Bowyer (Character) Odd-night Watcher (Role) The scum team was created with the interesting idea of encouraging a bus. Unfortunately, due to RNG the character that was supposed to bus was given to one of the YOLO scum players on the site and the player who was supposed to be bussed was given to one of the most careful. I feel like if the RNG here had been reversed scum would have won this game hands down, because Wryly's scum play was quite good and aside from the Wylted watcher flip I feel like Thoth had set himself up as an ideal mislynch target in the last DP.<img /><img /> Have never been more tempted to reroll a game, honestly. Wylted straight-claiming Candace was catastrophic due to the theme split being fairly obvious, and him getting lynched early meant that the one fake role claim they were given would seem sus after his flip. Scum also played a bit too conservatively with their night actions. There were two points where riskier plays would have paid off big time. They originally intended to lawyer Wryly and leave the cop alive - he actually investigated her and would have gotten an inno if they had done so. They also killed the tracker the same night he investigated Wryly while she used the Ninja and saw her not move. So, leaving these power roles alive would have resulted in two green checks on Wryly. MVP: Banana Banana came in clutch in the final DP, and the fact that she got minimal pushback for probably the scummiest town role I have ever designed was testament to how good her play was. I was fully expecting Wryly to win this one because Thoth had set himself up as such a perfect target due to his waffling on lynching Wylted DP2 while Wryly's vote was on him early. Banana put in the work to see through that. Great play, especially given the fact that she was coming back from several rounds of inactivity and replaced in halfway through. Notes on Balance:The game was heavy on protective and investigatives for two reasons. First was to compensate for the lovers. The lovers are a huge benefit to town, because they are town confirmed to one another and can coordinate a doc night action. They can lie about being lovers, they just have to avoid being NKd. I was surprised by their decision to use the NK to protect Luna, I had always expected in simulations for the Lover Doc to use the role to protect the most likely NK target among themselves due to the risk of a double kill if they didn't - if they didn't protect within the Lovers the chance of a double NK was 2/7 - 29%. With the protection it was a 14% of a double kill and a 14% of a no kill which basically erased the negative utility mathematically. On the other hand, the doc being outed DP1 was also not something I expected, so that makes their decision much more understandable. Second was the powerful range of abilities given to scum which would fuck with investigatives - the redirector, the mirror, the lawyer, the ninja, and the haunt. In a small game these roles could muddle results significantly, especially the mirror. The strengthener also existed to counter these manipulative roles, while they existed in such numbers to give town the ability to analyze and break down a game through analyzing night actions and figure out where people were misdirected or lying. Night Actions:NP1:Wylted: Mirror, Kill WFThoth: Rolestop WyltedPie: Track LunaSupa: Doc LunaMikal: Mikal submitted his night action as Roleblock this round. I fucked up and didn't realize that he was trying to use his even night role on an odd night, so I told Pie that his action failed before taking that back and giving him his result. I refused to elaborate on this further to Banana because I think it would unfairly role confirm her in Pie's mind if she explained what had actually happened, so I stayed mum. Banana ironically made the same mistake later on. NP2:Wylted: Rolecop Pie & kill LunaWryly: Redirect Banana to ThothThoth: CommuteLuna: Cop WrylyPie: Track Luna NP3:Wryly: Ninja kill PieBanana: Strengthen ThothPie: Track Wryly

#2

Town roles:

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#3

Yeah, we talked a lot about who to use the Doc on that first NP. Considering we had two players who had outed themselves as investigative, we figured one of them was almost certain to be the target of the NK, didn't expect scum would shoot in the dark. Even if we had functioned based entirely on that concern, I would've encouraged Supa to protect himself, so it wouldn't have mattered.

In any case, great job pulling this out at the end. Agreed, Banana in particular was solid in that last DP.

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#4

MVP: Banana

Banana came in clutch in the final DP, and the fact that she got minimal pushback for probably the scummiest town role I have ever designed was testament to how good her play was. I was fully expecting Wryly to win this one because Thoth had set himself up as such a perfect target due to his waffling on lynching Wylted DP2 while Wryly's vote was on him early. Banana put in the work to see through that. Great play, especially given the fact that she was coming back from several rounds of inactivity and replaced in halfway through.

wow first time ever getting mvp!! Ty for the comments

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(Last edited by RexFavilla on )

#5

--> @whiteflame

Originally Posted by whiteflame on 7/31/2026 at 9:57 AM (post #3)

Yeah, we talked a lot about who to use the Doc on that first NP. Considering we had two players who had outed themselves as investigative, we figured one of them was almost certain to be the target of the NK, didn't expect scum would shoot in the dark. Even if we had functioned based entirely on that concern, I would've encouraged Supa to protect himself, so it wouldn't have mattered.

In any case, great job pulling this out at the end. Agreed, Banana in particular was solid in that last DP.

Yeah, from your perspective you couldn't have known that one of them was scum, so the scum team was very wary of the claimed cop being protected and was looking elsewhere for the NK.

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<blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/whiteflame" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">whiteflame</a> on 7/31/2026 at 9:57 AM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=3" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#3</a>)</blockquote><blockquote>Yeah, we talked a lot about who to use the Doc on that first NP. Considering we had two players who had outed themselves as investigative, we figured one of them was almost certain to be the target of the NK, didn't expect scum would shoot in the dark. Even if we had functioned based entirely on that concern, I would've encouraged Supa to protect himself, so it wouldn't have mattered.</blockquote><blockquote> </blockquote><blockquote>In any case, great job pulling this out at the end. Agreed, Banana in particular was solid in that last DP.</blockquote>Yeah, from your perspective you couldn't have known that one of them was scum, so the scum team was very wary of the claimed cop being protected and was looking elsewhere for the NK.

#6

Pie would've turbolynched me when he saw wylted's Watcher flip, and Lunatic never copped me, so I'm not sure what you mean, big dawg.

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(Last edited by Wryly on )

#7

I could've played this better. My original idea was for wylted to take Odd Night Watcher and Nick Fuentes and for me to come up with a fake claim, but then he straight claimed Candace off the cuff and I just failed to repair the damage. I still had some hope of saving him when I claimed Watcher, but right after that he fake claimed 1x Vote Sensor and 1x Tracker and I knew he was dead. I floated the idea to him that he walk that back, claim he had a 1x BP and he was just trying to bait the NK with that Vote Sensor/Tracker shit, but I didn't know there was a 1x Commuter, so that might've looked bad. It was pretty frustrating, all in all. My role was the one perfect for a bus and his was perfect to take the safer claim, but there's no telling wylted not to do wylted. I should have come up with a better fake role claim immediately after he claimed Candace but I just really started to resent even having to think about the game on top of my other stressors.

I was genuinely angry about the boob joke fallout since that joke basically lost the game for me, lol. Guess I tried to compensate too much with humor, came off hammy. Still can't believe you guys genuinely considered that Rex put Candace's left tit in the game.

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I could've played this better. My original idea was for wylted to take Odd Night Watcher and Nick Fuentes and for me to come up with a fake claim, but then he straight claimed Candace off the cuff and I just failed to repair the damage. I still had some hope of saving him when I claimed Watcher, but right after that he fake claimed 1x Vote Sensor and 1x Tracker and I knew he was dead. I floated the idea to him that he walk that back, claim he had a 1x BP and he was just trying to bait the NK with that Vote Sensor/Tracker shit, but I didn't know there was a 1x Commuter, so that might've looked bad. It was pretty frustrating, all in all. My role was the one perfect for a bus and his was perfect to take the safer claim, but there's no telling wylted not to do wylted. I should have come up with a better fake role claim immediately after he claimed Candace but I just really started to resent even having to think about the game on top of my other stressors. I was genuinely angry about the boob joke fallout since that joke basically lost the game for me, lol. Guess I tried to compensate too much with humor, came off hammy. Still can't believe you guys genuinely considered that Rex put Candace's left tit in the game.

#8

--> @Wryly

Originally Posted by Wryly on 7/31/2026 at 10:45 AM (post #6)

Pie would've turbolynched me when he saw wylted's Watcher flip, and Lunatic never copped me, so I'm not sure what you mean, big dawg.

Yeah I can see the Pie kill for endgame manipulation purposes. But Luna copped you on the night that he died. You and Wylted were considering leaving him alive and having you lawyering yourself. Had you done that, Luna would have reported an inno on you.

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#9

Definitely huge props to Banana. I thought Thoth was going to sell like the other game but he held up when it mattered

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#10

--> @RexFavilla

Originally Posted by RexFavilla on 7/31/2026 at 11:20 AM (post #8)

Originally Posted by Wryly on 7/31/2026 at 10:45 AM (post #6)

Pie would've turbolynched me when he saw wylted's Watcher flip, and Lunatic never copped me, so I'm not sure what you mean, big dawg.

Yeah I can see the Pie kill for endgame manipulation purposes. But Luna copped you on the night that he died. You and Wylted were considering leaving him alive and having you lawyering yourself. Had you done that, Luna would have reported an inno on you.

Oh I see. Well if I had lawyered I wouldn't have been able to redirect, which would have left Banana or Thoth free to use their powers, and that felt like too much of a risk. I still didn't know what Thoth's remaining power was and thought it might be a targeting power.

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<blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/RexFavilla" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">RexFavilla</a> on 7/31/2026 at 11:20 AM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=8" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#8</a>)</blockquote><blockquote> </blockquote><blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/Wryly" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">Wryly</a> on 7/31/2026 at 10:45 AM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=6" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#6</a>)</blockquote><blockquote>Pie would've turbolynched me when he saw wylted's Watcher flip, and Lunatic never copped me, so I'm not sure what you mean, big dawg.</blockquote><blockquote>Yeah I can see the Pie kill for endgame manipulation purposes. But Luna copped you on the night that he died. You and Wylted were considering leaving him alive and having you lawyering yourself. Had you done that, Luna would have reported an inno on you.</blockquote> Oh I see. Well if I had lawyered I wouldn't have been able to redirect, which would have left Banana or Thoth free to use their powers, and that felt like too much of a risk. I still didn't know what Thoth's remaining power was and thought it might be a targeting power.

#11

--> @ILikePie5

Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 7/31/2026 at 11:30 AM (post #9)

Definitely huge props to Banana. I thought Thoth was going to sell like the other game but he held up when it mattered

Agree. NGL I’d have voted Thoth

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"Kohai, your entrance to the thread was legendary, you had a solve and a winning PoE right when you showed up, super impressive stuff, even more so considering it wasn't even your objective!!" - Zrein

#12

--> @Wryly

Originally Posted by Wryly on 7/31/2026 at 11:35 AM (post #10)

Originally Posted by RexFavilla on 7/31/2026 at 11:20 AM (post #8)

Originally Posted by Wryly on 7/31/2026 at 10:45 AM (post #6)

Pie would've turbolynched me when he saw wylted's Watcher flip, and Lunatic never copped me, so I'm not sure what you mean, big dawg.

Yeah I can see the Pie kill for endgame manipulation purposes. But Luna copped you on the night that he died. You and Wylted were considering leaving him alive and having you lawyering yourself. Had you done that, Luna would have reported an inno on you.

Oh I see. Well if I had lawyered I wouldn't have been able to redirect, which would have left Banana or Thoth free to use their powers, and that felt like too much of a risk. I still didn't know what Thoth's remaining power was and thought it might be a targeting power.

Yeah I say overall you guys lost because Wylted took risks where you should have been much more cautious (claiming) and you were both cautious where you could have been a bit more risky (night actions). It's really hard to dig yourself out of a hole if you fuck up a claim, you can usually much more easily argue yourself out of a result concerning your night actions. You did your best with what you had and had you won you would have gotten MVP, so don't beat yourself up too much about it. Just some constructive feedback.

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<blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/Wryly" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">Wryly</a> on 7/31/2026 at 11:35 AM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=10" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#10</a>)</blockquote><blockquote> </blockquote><blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/RexFavilla" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">RexFavilla</a> on 7/31/2026 at 11:20 AM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=8" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#8</a>)</blockquote><blockquote> </blockquote><blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/Wryly" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">Wryly</a> on 7/31/2026 at 10:45 AM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=6" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#6</a>)</blockquote><blockquote>Pie would've turbolynched me when he saw wylted's Watcher flip, and Lunatic never copped me, so I'm not sure what you mean, big dawg.</blockquote><blockquote>Yeah I can see the Pie kill for endgame manipulation purposes. But Luna copped you on the night that he died. You and Wylted were considering leaving him alive and having you lawyering yourself. Had you done that, Luna would have reported an inno on you.</blockquote><blockquote> </blockquote><blockquote>Oh I see. Well if I had lawyered I wouldn't have been able to redirect, which would have left Banana or Thoth free to use their powers, and that felt like too much of a risk. I still didn't know what Thoth's remaining power was and thought it might be a targeting power.</blockquote> Yeah I say overall you guys lost because Wylted took risks where you should have been much more cautious (claiming) and you were both cautious where you could have been a bit more risky (night actions). It's really hard to dig yourself out of a hole if you fuck up a claim, you can usually much more easily argue yourself out of a result concerning your night actions. You did your best with what you had and had you won you would have gotten MVP, so don't beat yourself up too much about it. Just some constructive feedback.

#13

GGs guys sorry about inactivity. Looks like town clutched it up.

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In loving Memory of Lannan and Ajab, fallen debaters.

#14

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#15

Tbh I wouldn’t expect Wylted to play conservative. If I was scum I’d just adapt my playstyle and strategy around him to make optimal plays

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In loving Memory of Lannan and Ajab, fallen debaters.

#16

--> @Lunatic

Sorry but that just irks me dude, especially considering it got four likes. I really could have planned better for his suicide, but I take exception to the idea that I shouldn't expect him not to commit suicide.

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#17

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#18

--> @Wryly

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#19

I'm sorry guys, I think I'm just burnt out and my fuse is short... please ignore me.

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#20

Poking around from the outside, it seemed like an interesting game. wp town, you weren’t scared of the game 7 lights

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I still don’t know what to type!

#21

Even with Wryly/Charlie Kirk born to be bussed, Rex did y'all dirty with a fake-claim that was semi-CC'd by wylted's flip. I would say that I would have voted Banana otherwise, but the whole game would have played out differently, so that's rather meaningless.

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Forum signatures are bullshit. Nobody wants to waste their time and bandwidth reading something they have read 29,998,559,671,349 times before.

#22

--> @Wryly

Originally Posted by Wryly on 7/31/2026 at 1:02 PM (post #16)

Sorry but that just irks me dude, especially considering it got four likes. I really could have planned better for his suicide, but I take exception to the idea that I shouldn't expect him not to commit suicide.

Hey I didn’t mean that as a jab at you or a critic of your play at all. You did very well in this game. In hindsight reading that I can see why you took it as “blaming the victim of being wylteds scum partner” lmao but I promise it wasn’t meant that way.

If anything I am agreeing that Wylted has a reckless playstyle. I am just saying since I know how Wylted will play, when I am his scum partner I will change my own personal playstyle to him, because I know him. I would do the same for any of my scum partners really. If I was scum with pie, I know we’d probably be making extremely safe plays that ensure the win with 0 risk, which is not my personal favorite way to play scum, but I know he’s all about securing the dub so I’d play it that way with him. Wasn’t criticizing your play at all I really hope you know. If anything I was agreeing with you about Wylted being reckless. I’ve just realized that complaining about how people play doesn’t help most of the time. Some times it does lol. But alot of these people that play still are still doing the same stuff they did years ago, so I just kind of started accepting certain behaviors and playing around them.

My bad if it sounds like I was lecturing you. Not at all what I was going for.

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<blockquote>Originally Posted by <a href="/users/Wryly" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">Wryly</a> on 7/31/2026 at 1:02 PM (post <a href="https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/endgames/posts/7v/candace-owens-extended-universe-endgame?comment_number=16" rel="noopener noreferrer nofollow" target="_blank">#16</a>)</blockquote><blockquote>Sorry but that just irks me dude, especially considering it got four likes. I really could have planned better for his suicide, but I take exception to the idea that I shouldn't expect him not to commit suicide.</blockquote>Hey I didn’t mean that as a jab at you or a critic of your play at all. You did very well in this game. In hindsight reading that I can see why you took it as “blaming the victim of being wylteds scum partner” lmao but I promise it wasn’t meant that way. If anything I am agreeing that Wylted has a reckless playstyle. I am just saying since I know how Wylted will play, when I am his scum partner I will change my own personal playstyle to him, because I know him. I would do the same for any of my scum partners really. If I was scum with pie, I know we’d probably be making extremely safe plays that ensure the win with 0 risk, which is not my personal favorite way to play scum, but I know he’s all about securing the dub so I’d play it that way with him. Wasn’t criticizing your play at all I really hope you know. If anything I was agreeing with you about Wylted being reckless. I’ve just realized that complaining about how people play doesn’t help most of the time. Some times it does lol. But alot of these people that play still are still doing the same stuff they did years ago, so I just kind of started accepting certain behaviors and playing around them. My bad if it sounds like I was lecturing you. Not at all what I was going for.

In loving Memory of Lannan and Ajab, fallen debaters.

#23

--> @Lunatic

I appreciate that man. ❤️ Sorry for being prickly.

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