K-Pop Demon Hunters Mafia - DP2

For reasons I don't want to get into yet, the DP1 no-lynch might be less bad than it seems.

Scratch this out. I forgot that Rex died.

I noticed that the letters in our are next to Pie on my keyboard. I think that's what you meant to type.

Yeah, same. Either that or autocorrect.

For reasons I don't want to get into yet, the DP1 no-lynch might be less bad than it seems.

I still think it would have made more sense to lynch, but given the outcome, we're still in good shape.

Not to suggest you would know who scum is/are if you are town, but naming three out of four people as sus strikes me as scummily non-committal, especially because, in some sense, those are three out of three people since Vader is silenced.

Yeah, it is a little odd, though he then went on to townread me, so I guess he's between you and Pie. There are other things about his posts that stand out more to me, but I can see your point.

I agree that I think whiteflame is town, although, on second thought, that's entirely a behavioral read, and he's been reading so townie to me that I forgot that I haven't seen him be mechanically cleared.

Yeah, I'm not mechanically cleared nor should I be. I can claim if it's broadly desired. If I had to pick who I thought should claim first, my choice is between Pie and Luna. Going to sleep on it.

I can confirm that Magic told me, if a player's action fails for any reason, they would be told that their action failed, and nothing else. I hate to bother him with redundant questions, but I have to confirm that y'all are not lying about what he said.

What is the justification for Jinu being doomed? That he turned from a human into a demon? Seems loose, if you ask me, which makes me think that the remaining characters might have roles that don't seem to fit them.

Does this mean the other scum is probably Gwi-Ma?

What is the justification for Jinu being doomed? That he turned from a human into a demon? Seems loose, if you ask me, which makes me think that the remaining characters might have roles that don't seem to fit them.

Does this mean the other scum is probably Gwi-Ma?

It's not stated and it's a spoiler, but Jinu does bite it at the end of the movie. He's already a demon, but in the end, he gives his soul over to Rumi as he protects her from Gwi-Ma's attack in his last moments. That's why I said you could argue that the scum team is either Jinu/Gwi-Ma or Jinu/Rumi, though the former makes more sense than the latter given that the character that "dooms" him is Gwi-Ma. It's not proof positive, but I think it's likely that it's just straight up demons vs. everyone else.

We need spoiler tags on here.

Less amenable to this position. Going into this DP, we should have expected one NK. The fact that we got scum had everything to do with Rex's role, something we couldn't have known coming into it. So supporting a NL last DP would have been extremely odd since you would have expected a 4-2 or 4-1-1, i.e. either LYLO or awfully close to it with a TP. Going to need you to explain why a NL made sense as strategy.

It was discussed that 2 mislynches would be game over if there was two scum. We theorized there was one, but didn't know. Knowing there is two I can say in hindsight it was definitely a good idea, but we didn't have very many strong conclusions where I had left on in the game, so I would have probably erred on the side of caution either way, leaning towards a no lynch.

Just asked and he told me that anyone whose night actions failed would be informed that they failed. That's not a direct statement that they'd been RB'd, but that is a message they would receive if they had been. Not sure where you got this.

I was told that magic does not give a "you were roleblocked" message.

...why? Pie literally laid out all the plausible characters in this game and Thoth pretty blatant about his character being the name of a Chinese dynasty. Not hard to figure out who Kohai was and intuit his role. And by "our" I'm guessing you mean Pie.

Thats why I said I think it would be you pie or thoth. Vader I doubt knows a ton about the show, and I already said I didn't as well.

I was told that magic does not give a "you were roleblocked" message.

This does not contradict the answer he gave me. He told me that if your actions fails for any reason, you are told that your action failed, but not the reason why, which could be that you were roleblocked.

Before I go to sleep, I'll leave a Yes/No question for Pie: Do you think I have breadcrumbed a role (not character) at any time in this game?

Anyone else is free to answer that question, but it's mainly for Pie.

It was discussed that 2 mislynches would be game over if there was two scum. We theorized there was one, but didn't know. Knowing there is two I can say in hindsight it was definitely a good idea, but we didn't have very many strong conclusions where I had left on in the game, so I would have probably erred on the side of caution either way, leaning towards a no lynch.

I still don't get this perspective. I'm consistently overcautious when it comes to lynches on DP1, but I didn't see anyone suggesting a NL DP1 and if someone had, I would have pushed back. The scenario we all believed was plausible was 1 scum, 1 TP. That would have brought us to 4-1-1. That may not be LYLO, but given that we necessarily wouldn't know the wincon of the TP, it very well could have functioned in the same way, meaning we could still have been one mislynch away from game over. Sure, there was a risk of a mislynch DP1, but I'd much rather have gotten a lynch off and shaved down POE than just sat on our hands and hoped for the best.

I was told that magic does not give a "you were roleblocked" message.

So you specifically asked him if players would receive that message and not whether they'd receive any message? That isn't what you said initially (you said they "would not receive a message") and it's an odd way to frame that question.

Thats why I said I think it would be you pie or thoth. Vader I doubt knows a ton about the show, and I already said I didn't as well.

Again, though, the information I pointed to came out during the DP. Whether scum know anything about the show is largely irrelevant to whether they knew who Kohai was. It was pretty damn obvious that the character named Healer Han (Pie gave a full character list) was a) the only one with the name of a Chinese dynasty (Thoth said as much) b) the only character whose name would give away their role (Kohai gave that away). It doesn't take someone with extensive knowledge about the show to put the pieces together.

Before I go to sleep, I'll leave a Yes/No question for Pie: Do you think I have breadcrumbed a role (not character) at any time in this game?

I'll need to read back through the DPs to see, planning on doing that when I get more time later.

Rex's death is a surprise. I sussed him last DP, but the Doomed role is a shock. I can't say who he used it on, but that does explain how there could be a 2-person scum team in a 7-player game. I'll point out that the flip shows that Pie's theme split idea, which placed one or two Huntr/x members as the scum team, does not make sense anymore. You could argue that Jinu and Rumi are a possible scum team if you squint since they had a brief romance, but it's much more likely at this point that it's Jinu and Gwi-ma.

Do you agree with me now that it’s more likely than not that scum did get a fake claim of one of the main girls. With the way REFs role is designed, it’s only logical that one of the girls was given as a fake claim.

Do you agree with me now that it’s more likely than not that scum did get a fake claim of one of the main girls. With the way REFs role is designed, it’s only logical that one of the girls was given as a fake claim.

I'd say it's possible, especially given that one of the scum players was set to die by DP2. I could see Mharman giving scum a really good fake claim to balance the scales since they essentially had only one night to use Ref's role and use him for the NK (which I believe he did perform, since it didn't matter if he got found out), but I wouldn't say that's my default at this stage. At minimum, his flip reveals the likely theme split.

As pie pointed out we still have two mislynches which is an ideal spot unless mafia have some crazy roles.

Yep exactly, and the fake claim that was given to scum has to be a solid one as well, which actually works in our favor cause it’s more likely than not that one of the 3 girls was given as the fake claim.

i will say that I will probably be a lil skeptical of whoever ends up claiming roleblocked (I actually may have been the one to be roleblocked but idk, because I don’t think mharman tells you if your roleblocked) because if I was scum and knew my role would be outed publicly at the end of dp2 I would want to use that to farm town cred. But it’s not like solid proof the roleblocked person is scum obviously just something I will be a little weary of.

Ya I assume Supa was the one that was roleblocked? But he was also silenced? Ofc passive roles wouldn’t know either

Aside from my gut feeling, I have mild but non-negligible heuristic evidence against Pie that I will get into when the time is right, probably later this day phase.

Why wait, just spit it out

I think scum is an experienced player who either knows the theme or did research in the theme based on the night kill. My guess is it’s our or Whiteflame atm

WF has the most knowledge, but it was brutally obvious what Kohai was. It took me 5 seconds to figure it out based on what he and Thoth said and when I looked up the characters list. It wasn’t rocket science by any means

Before I go to sleep, I'll leave a Yes/No question for Pie: Do you think I have breadcrumbed a role (not character) at any time in this game?

Dont know but I need to reread. Regardless, if you did leave a breadcrumb, it doesn’t matter to me because of the fact that we know Mharman gave a fake character and role. If anything it makes you even more scummy imo

Alright, we've got to make some moves this DP and that starts with narrowing POE.

I haven't seen any disagreement with my framing of the theme split so far, but if people have some reason to believe it's not Gwi-Ma and Jinu, please clarify who you think Jinu's partner is. I recognize that that's not super relevant because know scum have access to a full fake claim and we know they're not going to claim Gwi-Ma.

As for who is in the game, I'd say we can bank on at least 2 of the members of Huntr/x being here. I don't see a world in which all 3 members play some kind of role in this game. Note: this does not mean I'm dismissing that the third could be excluded as a character and simply be a fake claim given to scum. The movie even includes a moment where two members of Huntr/x are impersonated by demons, it's not a stretch and it's even less of a stretch now that we know Rex was programmed to auto-die.

The long and short of it is that I'm not dismissing Thoth as potential scum at this point. He's in my POE, but I don't believe pursuing him for a claim does much of anything for us at this point. If he is scum, he's got a full fake claim available to him, so unless we believe Mharman did a bad job making it and we can spot inconsistencies, there's not a lot of value in pursuing him. The only potential value we get is in learning his role, and that only matters if we have someone who can validate anything he says he did. The only night action we can attribute to the other scum is that they Silenced Vader, and since I haven't seen anyone speak up about Tracking Thoth or Watching Vader, it's unlikely we're getting any insight into who did that.

That leaves Pie, Luna and Vader. Obviously, we're not getting Vader's claim at this point, so I'm setting him aside for this DP as an option. I've pointed out that he's an odd choice for Silencing given he usually doesn't play a very active role in discussions. I still think that decision stands out and I believe the possibility that he'd just Silence himself as scum is a very real one, it's just not enough for me to pursue him for a lynch right now.

Which, again, leaves Pie and Luna. I can see reason to pursue either of you for a claim.

Pie's claim is narrowed down to a small set of male characters, but he's most likely Bobby. Given all other male softclaims are dead, I can't imagine he's just one of the unnamed Sajas and he didn't give any hint that he's two characters, which would be required for him to be Derpy & Susie (I think he'd have listed them separately if he was just one of them, but the Wikipedia page lists them together). I'm not sure what role Bobby would have, but given that Healer Han is a far more minor character than him, I can buy him being in this game.

As for Luna, I'm a little more uncertain. He could be one of the three members of Huntr/x, the pool of which has already been publicly reduced by Thoth's softclaim. There's a more than decent chance that he's Celine. Far lower chance that he's Mi-yeong Ryu for reasons I mentioned last DP (barely a character, only exists in Rumi's backstory). I'm less concerned at this point about the risk of having a member of Huntr/x claim (we're presumably at 4-1 and it could be a fake claim anyway), so I'm willing to pursue him since there are more options on the table and I'd like to nail him down.

VTL Luna

For the sake of identifying the fake-claim if it's a main character, it might be worth having the other two main characters claim that they are a main character, but not which one. I won't push for it yet.

Vote Count

Thoth (1/3) - Pie

Lunatic (1/3) - Whiteflame

For the sake of identifying the fake-claim if it's a main character, it might be worth having the other two main characters claim that they are a main character, but not which one. I won't push for it yet.

Considering that as a possibility as well. Luna, we can start there if you'd like.

I just noticed something about my role PM which makes me think that one of the three main girls is more likely to be the fake-claim than either of the other two.

A little under 48 hours

technically 47

Considering that as a possibility as well. Luna, we can start there if you'd like.

Are you saying you’re not?

Are you saying you’re not?

I’m saying that I won’t be the first between the two of us to state that. If you have reason to push me for that information first, be my guest.

I’m saying that I won’t be the first between the two of us to state that. If you have reason to push me for that information first, be my guest.

Why does it matter? One of them is accounted for. You said yourself that the character pool is low. The odds are very likely that all 3 are in the game whether real or fake claim. I’m a male. So there are 2 girls between you, Luna, and Vader.

Why does it matter? One of them is accounted for. You said yourself that the character pool is low. The odds are very likely that all 3 are in the game whether real or fake claim. I’m a male. So there are 2 girls between you, Luna, and Vader.

I’d still say it matters, but since whatever he claims will either be dictated by his actual claim or the fake claim, I might as well just say it: I’m one of the three.

Does your role PM mention any character other than yours by name? Magic said it's okay to ask this.

It mentions one.