HCBM Mafia DP4

“Both of which he dismisses as irrelevant"

FMPOV, actually, everything you say is irrelevant anyway because it’s bullshit. But I’ll bite. I don’t even know if I would perform the NK or not, I do like WIFOMY NKs so I’ll grant you that, but I wouldn’t kill Thoth last night if I actually thought you were Bodyguard, which apparently scum!me would have to believe since you’d probably be telling the truth D3, I know I was.

it’s kinda useless for me to speculate on what I would do and wouldn’t do as scum, and what NKs I would even perform, I have’t thought about it because I’m not scum. If the argument is “Magoroth would NK X because [...]”, I can neither “invalidate” nor even engage with that argument because 1. I did not do it 2. I haven’t been in the business of NKing, and the world we live in would be completely different if I actually was scum.

if we play this game, then the reason you NK’d Thoth and Kohai is obvious, Thoth didn’t trust you, Kohai was probably in part a fear kill and in part because it narrowed the PoE, it was a ballsy move on your part because it brings us to the obvious “I can’t be scum because I’m narrowing my own PoE”, which kinda worked in your favour.

you claim however that I killed Kohai because it scum painted YOU TWO? Why in the world would I do that then doubt my own results? I was prepared to lynch outside of [Kohai, Mag1cman, Whiteflame] yesterday, I was uneasy with Thoth being away after being townread. Why in the world would I narrow the PoE then suggest my results may be bullshit anyway?

Will be on later tonight to catch up

I take your point that at least the Thoth NK could make sense for me, but I think the decision is at least equally plausible for you, too. I get that we have to get into these arguments at this point, but there's a reason it's called WIFOM.

To be clear on the Kohai point, it's a question of whether your doubt and uncertainty regarding Thoth were performative or real. From where I'm sitting, it's the former, and the apparent uncertainty (which neither I nor Wryly were onboard with) just comes off as an attempt to appear more townie. What is a known factor is that Kohai's NK did reduce POE based on your results, even if you did have trouble believing them.

So you think I magically knew all this time that we make it into the final three and masterminded some kinda plan that would only get me townread if somehow happened to mention the Kohai/Thoth NKs (both of which look good for you in a kinda superficial way and not for me) and then use the least likely argument possible, knowing ahead of time it would sound like a bunch of bs?

So you think I magically knew all this time that we make it into the final three and masterminded some kinda plan that would only get me townread if somehow happened to mention the Kohai/Thoth NKs (both of which look good for you in a kinda superficial way and not for me) and then use the least likely argument possible, knowing ahead of time it would sound like a bunch of bs?

I think you were trying to gain towncred wherever you could because there's value in getting towncred. Building a case for why you are behaviorally town is valuable regardless of the DP, and like I said, your uncertainty read as behaviorally town to me. That doesn't require any magical knowledge or masterminding, that's just one way to get people to buy that you aren't scum.

Just got home. Will be slowly reading through your posts.

So the setup isn’t actually that nuts in this case, Sensor/Tracker/Cop vs Ninja+Redirector is somewhat balanced, it also means my role is the only Investigative whose results are 100% guaranteed to be accurate.

Yep. It's 100% guaranteed to be accurate, except that you don't know what 100% accurate means and also it's not 100% accurate and Vader told you it cannot be manipulated by Godfather/Miller but also told you Godfather and Miller would interfere with your results.

Ask yourself this, why would Town!Whiteflame think you’re ALMOST confirmed Town? The mech is really weak lol.

No idea. Could have been a remote chance in his mind that I was a Godfather, I suppose.

Also - I wouldn’t kill Thoth if I was scum here. He seemed to be town reading me, or at least trusting Whiteflame and Mag1cman less than he trusts me. This kill benefits Whiteflame.

Yes, I know, WIFOM, but this really isn’t the time for WIFOM. It really only benefits Whiteflame. I don’t kill the person who can help me make it through endgame. You survived because you townread the scum.

I do question why I'm alive. Thoth would make sense for whiteflame to NK, but as he points out, Kohai did not make sense.

I could just be overthinking a lot of your decisions. Maybe you're just a player who flies by the seat of his pants and makes calls bases on what amuses you or what keeps people guessing.

*based

Fell asleep on top of my phone woke up with it super hot.

So if I've got this straight, the two scenarios I have to consider are:

1. Magoroth is scum, NK'd Thoth over me for some reason, and bussed Shining.

2. whiteflame is scum, there are basically no protective roles in the game, there are three investigative roles in the game, and whiteflame can only be a Redirector.

We don’t need any protective roles with three investigatives. The setup is weirdly balanced by the fact that it seems townsided, only it isn’t. It’s designed to make town mistrust each other.

it is like this on purpose. It’s an intentionally WIFOMMY setup which isn’t in our favour.

ask yourself this. Which fakeclaim is safer and easier to make, Bodyguard or Sensor? Neither our roles are proven; at least mine is proven partially correct thus far because Shining was scum, and I called out that PoE way before we decided to lynch shining.

I really didn't think I'd live to post a Wylted quote every day phase of this game.

Ramshutu: There is no band wagon to be jumping on, I have got through my release cycle - and I am now bored! Ask me anything: ask for jokes, witty out downs, incantations; etc.

Wylted: Why is this not in the personal section? How come you suck balls?

Ramshutu: 1.) I put this here to deliberately annoy you personally. 2.) I suck balls because I have the ability and I like the taste. On a side note: you do not suck balls, because even a dog; after eating three day old street vomit, old grass clippings then licking themselves; would likely question the hygiene of letting their testicles anywhere near your festering maw.

Wylted: That explains why my dog has been avoiding me

Ramshutu: I'm sure it's not just dogs.

Wylted: Clearly, but since they are the least picky beings it is obvious that other beings will not lick ny balls either with the exception of your mother.

Ramshutu: That wasn’t my mother; I paid Haley Joel Osmet $10 and 20 McNuggets to dress in drag. He told me there wasnt enough barbeque sauce in the world to make him do it again.

Wylted: Hopefully he is a fan of Szechuan sauce then.

Whatever happened to Ram anyway?

Savant: The theme of this game will be feminism, and I'll be co-hosting with Pie. Going to be 7v2 with a theme split.

AdaptableRatman: I will sign up if you listen to this fresh new UK rap track and admit the average UK rapper can take an average US rapper and smack them up down left right diagonal in a rap battle.

Wylted-Lashwnda: Nigga what y'all got to rap about? 'Oh my my, look at that strumpet! Oh nigga nigga, I done dropped my crumpet'

And, do you think as a new player I risk my neck out by claiming a role I didn’t even know existed? I wouldn’t fakeclaim a role thag I don’t even know to use, nor ask any of the questions I asked. I’m not that bloody erratic as scum to fakeclaim a role and then doubt its results, I got a lot of flak especially from Mag1c over my mistrust of my results.

it’d be way safer for me to claim something easy like Doctor or something. It’s not like there’s as many questions to ask about that as about a Sensor, less opportunity to slip.

We don’t need any protective roles with three investigatives. The setup is weirdly balanced by the fact that it seems townsided, only it isn’t. It’s designed to make town mistrust each other.

it is like this on purpose. It’s an intentionally WIFOMMY setup which isn’t in our favour.

ask yourself this. Which fakeclaim is safer and easier to make, Bodyguard or Sensor? Neither our roles are proven; at least mine is proven partially correct thus far because Shining was scum, and I called out that PoE way before we decided to lynch shining.

They're both risky claims for scum, since most games are going to have protective and investigative roles.

The only way I see scum!whiteflame claiming Bodyguard is if someone in the graveyard originally had it but it was tailored out, like Rex. But that doesn't make sense with DP1 #400.

As for your other point, I find 2 investigatives + 1 protective a lot easier to believe than 3 investigatives + no protective. I've only played six games, but I have yet to play one without some kind of role which mitigated scum's lethality. The closest was maybe Alien mafia, which had no direct protective but did have a Martyr, an Apportioner, and a Hunter. Bleeder does nothing to either stop or mitigate an NK.

Who cares how “specific” the circumstances for you to be scum have to be? This is manipulation. You are NOT saying you aren’t scum, you are saying that you should not be scum. No 1. you are not even flat out saying “I’m not scum”, you are saying “I cannot be scum”, which is not only a lie (I could be a scum from Wryly’s perspective and even admitted as such), it is also manipulation. Someone who isn’t scum would just state it, scumbag. You’re not doing it. I will flat out do it, as I’ve already done it before: I AM NOT SCUM.

Because the more specific the scum circumstances have to be, the less likely they become, a point Mag1cman tried to drive home last DP but which fell on my deaf ears because I just had it in my head that the suspect who didn't bus must be likelier than the suspect who did.

Saying "I'm not scum" is meaningless, I have no idea why swearing it or not swearing it has any weight at all in a lying game where mechanics matter and honor doesn't.

have you never lied before? liars usually try to avoid flat out lying and try to find ways around by stating things like “I cannot have done this” instead of a crystal clear lie like “I did not do this”

And, do you think as a new player I risk my neck out by claiming a role I didn’t even know existed? I wouldn’t fakeclaim a role thag I don’t even know to use, nor ask any of the questions I asked. I’m not that bloody erratic as scum to fakeclaim a role and then doubt its results, I got a lot of flak especially from Mag1c over my mistrust of my results.

it’d be way safer for me to claim something easy like Doctor or something. It’s not like there’s as many questions to ask about that as about a Sensor, less opportunity to slip.

This is wifom, and I have only your word that you didn't know it existed.

I'll grant your behavior all game hasn't made much since as town, and it's why I've been inclined to townread you up until now. But I don't find it impossible that you're just a player who likes to play it loose and risky. You play tipsy, you're impulsive, and you do dumb shit just for the sake of it.

have you never lied before? liars usually try to avoid flat out lying and try to find ways around by stating things like “I cannot have done this” instead of a crystal clear lie like “I did not do this”

1. Everyone has lied before.
2. In a game like mafia you're much more likely to sway someone with mechanical arguments than vows of innocence.

*sense not since

god i wish we could edit for typos

if you don’t look at me with red tinted glasses, my behaviour makes perfect sense as Town who is afraid of being wrong and given an unfamiliar role, on a new site. like if you just try to set aside your suspicion for a second, I am pretty straightforward and not exactly hard to read.

on the other hand, ask yourself, again, which claim is obviously more advantageous: mine or Whiteflame’s? why would a bodyguard even claim actually instead of saying “I am not an investigative”? Golden rule is you never claim as protective.

you claim at MyLo which we weren’t at. a real bodyguard stays hidden and doesn’t claim in the hopes of protecting an important role; he could’ve taken a bullet instead of some other role, like for instance, you or Thoth.

Just try to ignore the claims for a second. Read without mech and you can find me as Town pretty easily. It is only my claim, which is true, that fucks me over.

I don't think saying "I am not an investigative" is claiming, and I don't think it's particularly scummy. Thoth also admitted he was not an investigative.

if you don’t look at me with red tinted glasses, my behaviour makes perfect sense as Town who is afraid of being wrong and given an unfamiliar role, on a new site. like if you just try to set aside your suspicion for a second, I am pretty straightforward and not exactly hard to read.

I've given the "new guy" argument some credit up until now. But you are an experienced player, there is no way to tell if you've ever heard of Sensor or not, and you've changed your story on the details of your role several times.

Just try to ignore the claims for a second. Read without mech and you can find me as Town pretty easily. It is only my claim, which is true, that fucks me over.

I won't read without mech analysis.

My gut got Mag1c mislynched.

blame that on poor communication with the host. I wasn’t sure which questions to ask, nor how to interpret the answers I was given.

so basically I was told results I get are 100% reliable. Then I asked the host if its possible to see 1 scum on the lynch when in fact there were 0 or 2 and he at first gave me the first answer he gave me at start. then we got into “you are immune to manipulation” and “you are affected by Miller and Godfather”.

obviously, the reason the host said this is because those two roles aren’t in the game

okay that makes sense, then I have to somehow convince you this setup is real.

think from the perspective of a host. he is not God and can make mistakes. I can see a host giving scum Ninja and Redirector vs Cop/Tracker, then adding a Sensor to the town that gets accurate results. it sorta makes sense to put these roles, the hope obviously is for the cop and tracker to get bullshit results, or at least POTENTIALLY bullshit results, and Sensor to get accurate ones.

it’s rather creative setup design. Sensor can see completely different things than the Cop and the Tracker. making all investigatives doubt each other’s results.

I suppose if the host was exceptionally evil he would add Godfather and/or Miller into the mix as well, but its a little crazy, although not impossible.

not the case this game, just thinking about possibilities

and you are right I am experienced, but this role is not common on /MS/SC2, the sites I played on. I suppose you’re gonna have to trust me on this, but I’ll double check the MS wiki (it 100% doesn’t exist on sc2)

I cannot even check the MS wiki because the site is down. lol

Oh so IT is on the Wiki. Well rip.

but if you check the latest games this year on MS (never played there before), it wasn’t in any game I played in, at least