Solo Leveling DP 5

If the team ends up being awesome / Rex can I at least get props for being the first one to solve it?

if u think this is the team but are voting me in you are lying about ur reads. in what world do you get credit for calling out the scum team if u aren’t pursuing that scum team?

VTL Awesome5000

Wryly: *gets two wrong results*

also wryly: “my third result has narrowed Poe and you would be stupid to question its validity”

Lol.

I don't think you'd be stupid to question it, but I would like to hear an explanation for my result other than "but you were wrong before." Unless we agree that Mikal decided to make his mechanics absolute gobbledygook, then there's an explanation for why I was wrong before, and now that we've found a plausible explanation, you don't seem to want to engage that context -- you just seem to want to emphasize the narrative of "two wrong results = all results meaningless."

Did you get confirmation that a strengthener would nullify that, and make your results read town if a miller was town?

Yes.

Ok.

The problem is unless there’s a way to clear awesome as a legit strengthener there’s no reason to trust your result

Why do you believe awesome is actually a strengthener? The problem is there’s nothing to verify this.

Wryly: *gets two wrong results*

also wryly: “my third result has narrowed Poe and you would be stupid to question its validity”

Banana, I get being frustrated, really I do, but this kind of response isn’t helping your case. Wryly got one result that has since been proven wrong. The second result on Pie was proven right, but only after it became clear how her role actually works.

And this third result comes with important information that has in part been confirmed by Mikal. That includes it being used on a member of Wryly’s own Guild (which would theoretically result in confirmation that REF is not also part of the scum team), on a player who has claimed to functionally be a Miller for Wryly’s role (so it should show that he’s sus despite being in the Guild), and also getting Strengthened by Awesome’s role (which should negate the effect of the Miller and any other roles that might make REF look sus when he isn’t a part of the scum team). It’s not a given that that’s how things played out, but the result matches what we’d expect if that went down and both REF and Awesome were telling the truth. Dismissing all that with a “you got untrustworthy results before” isn’t going to cut it.

Lol. 

I don't think you'd be stupid to question it, but I would like to hear an explanation for my result other than "but you were wrong before." Unless we agree that Mikal decided to make his mechanics absolute gobbledygook, then there's an explanation for why I was wrong before, and now that we've found a plausible explanation, you don't seem to want to engage that context -- you just seem to want to emphasize the narrative of "two wrong results = all results meaningless."

i think it’s safe to say at this point that

scum have incentive to lie so we don’t know whose being honest about their roles or who they visited to begin with. u have to be a bit naive to keep taking results at face value when they’ve been wrong twice. Idk what happened, u don’t know what happened, we can theorize about it all day but at the end of the day it’s just a theory and if u want to believe someone is scum, me for example, u can just keep using that as an excuse to scum read them. the problem is you said my behavior is townie, so the fact that ur pushing this so hard despite thinking my behavior is town demonstrates to me that u have ur mind made up or u are banking more on the results than we should be.

Why do you believe awesome is actually a strengthener? The problem is there’s nothing to verify this.

My innocent result on Rex is verification; that was my intent. If he's not really a Strengthener, I should've gotten a guilty on Rex because Rex's ability returns false investigation results. The only way awesome is scum is if 1) he redirected me, but if he did, who redirected Pie? and 2) awesome and Rex are both scum, tried to NK either Pie or Banana NP3, and Rex lawyered NP4.

VTL Awesome5000

Your stance is distinctly noted.

Banana, I get being frustrated, really I do, but this kind of response isn’t helping your case. Wryly got one result that has since been proven wrong. The second result on Pie was proven right, but only after it became clear how her role actually works

nothing i say seems to help my case. Anything I say gets used against me no matter what i do or say. No matter what happens im in the Poe. There’s nothing I can do about that. i have no way to confirm myself. Period. even if i somehow survived today my lynch is absolutely inevitable. we can afford the mislynches so it’s not the end of the world but if I’m going to be lynched i do want it at the very least to serve some kind of point or give town some kind of lesson going forward, in this case that mechanics aren’t reliable. the only truth and constant I have is that I am town and all u have is my word on that which will never be enough.

Dismissing all that with a “you got untrustworthy results before” isn’t going to cut it.

i mean ur telling me this but I KNOW I AM TOWN. so it’s impossible not to look at this and kind of laugh when we are doing the same thing and beating this dead horse like it will be anything different when i know for a fact it won’t be. again at this point I can only hope it will be some sort of lesson learned

The only way awesome is scum is if 1) he redirected me, but if he did, who redirected Pie? and 2) awesome and Rex are both scum, tried to NK either Pie or Banana NP3, and Rex lawyered NP4.

this just proves my point that u guys already know there’s things that could factor and effect results and probably more variables than this we haven’t considered but u will keep returning to the “but tha seems unlikely” to any other alternative that comes up

Your stance is distinctly noted.

In other words anyone who dares suspect ur other guildie who you think is confirmed town all of a sudden will face the full wrath of the tigers. lol

VTL Banana

nothing i say seems to help my case. Anything I say gets used against me no matter what i do or say. No matter what happens im in the Poe. There’s nothing I can do about that. i have no way to confirm myself. Period. even if i somehow survived today my lynch is absolutely inevitable. we can afford the mislynches so it’s not the end of the world but if I’m going to be lynched i do want it at the very least to serve some kind of point or give town some kind of lesson going forward, in this case that mechanics aren’t reliable. the only truth and constant I have is that I am town and all u have is my word on that which will never be enough.

I'm not straight up calling you scum right now, am I? I'm just responding to what you posted. It's fine if you don't want to engage on mechanics, but dismissing them outright as unimportant is an odd choice. We all understand that mechanics aren't gospel, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss them out of hand. Whether you're scum or town, it's a weak response.

i mean ur telling me this but I KNOW I AM TOWN. so it’s impossible not to look at this and kind of laugh when we are doing the same thing and beating this dead horse like it will be anything different when i know for a fact it won’t be. again at this point I can only hope it will be some sort of lesson learned

I disagree that this situation is the same as others that came before. We know essential elements regarding how Wryly's role works that we didn't have last time we were interpreting her results. We have specific information about how REF's role and Awesome's role work that were not clear going into this DP, the latter of which was mod confirmed, and both interact specifically with Wryly. They're all in the same Guild together, so they could confirm each other's actions to a greater degree. This isn't meant to reflect on our read of you, but it does (and should) influence POE.

Your stance is distinctly noted.

If banana flips scum you have my permission to turbo lynch me tomorrow.

But in a t!Banana world who’s scum?

The attempt by Kohai and Banana to force poe wider on shoddy reasoning is pretty damning to me. Its like they know they cannot get enough mislynchs poking around in Mestari/Magic/WF and realized that if Awesome and I are foreclosed on as mislynch targets they will lose the game.

If banana flips town then who is scum for you? If she flips town then who’s her partner once I flip town?

i think it’s safe to say at this point that

scum have incentive to lie so we don’t know whose being honest about their roles or who they visited to begin with. u have to be a bit naive to keep taking results at face value when they’ve been wrong twice. Idk what happened, u don’t know what happened, we can theorize about it all day but at the end of the day it’s just a theory and if u want to believe someone is scum, me for example, u can just keep using that as an excuse to scum read them. the problem is you said my behavior is townie, so the fact that ur pushing this so hard despite thinking my behavior is town demonstrates to me that u have ur mind made up or u are banking more on the results than we should be.

I'm open to my mech reasoning being wrong, but I'm not open to opting out of mech reasoning altogether as long as mech is in the game. I'm open to alternate scenarios that could explain my results, flaws in my logic, things I may have overlooked -- but just saying "u don't know" doesn't help me and isn't even really trying to engage the data.

this just proves my point that u guys already know there’s things that could factor and effect results and probably more variables than this we haven’t considered but u will keep returning to the “but tha seems unlikely” to any other alternative that comes up

What variables? Like help me out here girl lol. Weighing probabilities and likelihoods has always been a part of mafia. I can't just cut that out of the game.

I'm not straight up calling you scum right now, am I? I'm just responding to what you posted. It's fine if you don't want to engage on mechanics, but dismissing them outright as unimportant is an odd choice. We all understand that mechanics aren't gospel, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss them out of hand. Whether you're scum or town, it's a weak response.

i wouldnt be dismissive of results in any other game. just this one because clearly we don’t understand all the mechanics and so much of it relies on ppl telling the truth about their roles and results, or scum not having the ability to manipulate them. we have every reason to believe scum have that ability with two wrong results so I don’t think it’s that far fetched to say dismissing results and mech is that crazy. I just want behavior to be some sort of factor in any of this and it isn’t anyone’s priority

I disagree that this situation is the same as others that came before. We know essential elements regarding how Wryly's role works that we didn't have last time we were interpreting her results. We have specific information about how REF's role and Awesome's role work that were not clear going into this DP, the latter of which was mod confirmed, and both interact specifically with Wryly. They're all in the same Guild together, so they could confirm each other's actions to a greater degree. This isn't meant to reflect on our read of you, but it does (and should) influence POE.

we can agree to disagree but the only way u will see the error of ur beliefs is unfortunately by mislynching me so it is what it is

we can agree to disagree but the only way u will see the error of ur beliefs is unfortunately by mislynching me so it is what it is

I'm having PTSD flashbacks to Helz

The attempt by Kohai and Banana to force poe wider on shoddy reasoning is pretty damning to me. Its like they know they cannot get enough mislynchs poking around in Mestari/Magic/WF and realized that if Awesome and I are foreclosed on as mislynch targets they will lose the game

my Poe is based on behavior actually and it’s pretty narrow. I said earlier my Poe is kohai/wf/awesome/rex, removing kohai and wf for behavior reasons. I said I would be willing to place all my cards on u and awesome being the last two scum. I’d say that’s a narrow Poe considering there’s only two scum left lol

I want everyone to answer this question

1. If banana town who’s scum?

2. If banana flips scum I’m obviously the lynch. When I flip town who’s her partner?

i wouldnt be dismissive of results in any other game. just this one because clearly we don’t understand all the mechanics and so much of it relies on ppl telling the truth about their roles and results, or scum not having the ability to manipulate them. we have every reason to believe scum have that ability with two wrong results so I don’t think it’s that far fetched to say dismissing results and mech is that crazy. I just want behavior to be some sort of factor in any of this and it isn’t anyone’s priority

So even when we're straight up given information on the mechanics of how certain roles work by Mikal and it's confirmed by other players, we should just set them aside? I get that scum can manipulate them, but this was clearly a strategy they worked out in their Guild, so you'd have to believe that someone in there is scum or that someone knew what they'd do and manipulated this outcome from the outside. Which are you going with?

Also, to be clear again, we have one wrong result on Alyssa and an apparently correct result on Pie, we just didn't understand the context for that second result at the time.

we can agree to disagree but the only way u will see the error of ur beliefs is unfortunately by mislynching me so it is what it is

Focusing on one thing at a time. If you believe this result should go away, I want more than just "there has been manipulation before" as a reason.

I want everyone to answer this question

1. If banana town who’s scum?

2. If banana flips scum I’m obviously the lynch. When I flip town who’s her partner?

Well, for the second question, I'd be considering Mestari more closely. If my theory about the Ant King and how that character activated is correct, I could see a world where Mestari's scum.

The first question is more difficult. I'd be looking at you again and I'd have to reconsider my read on Mag1c as well, though I don't see it as likely that he's an original member of the scum team.

But in a t!Banana world who’s scum?

I start looking at you and Mestari, and I push for a Mag1c claim.

Can you explain what it is about the awesome/Rex reasoning you don't agree with?

I start looking at you and Mestari, and I push for a Mag1c claim.

IN what world am I paired with Mestari?

Can you explain what it is about the awesome/Rex reasoning you don't agree with?

It is just a very easy way for them to clear themselves.