Amber Mafia - DP3

please ignore this post. This is a debugging test.

alright will give some thoughts later

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Not Voting (6): A-Bleys, A-Brand, A-Caine, A-Deirdre, A-Llewella, A-Random

With 6 players alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day phase ends in 3 days.

A-Bleys has been turned into a hydra. There is a second player in that slot.

Towards the end of the day I think the jailer should out themselves. We have two confirmed town and if we lynch scum today the night kill can function as a red or green check.

Pretty confident in the POE Bleys, Brand, and Llewella. I need to re evaluate random

One thing giving me pause is this post

https://www.debatecraft.com/mafia/c/active-games/posts/5k/amber-mafia---dp2?page=18&comment_number=535

does wolf Fiona really put both partners in this list? The only explanation for such retarded play is if scum were confident they can win. I do fear we MIs cleared someone so I want to go over this game with a fine tooth comb

No idea why I'm still alive. Had a whole will written out and ready to go, too. Guess I'll have to save that for later.

By the by, the new post is from One Piece.

So we've got 6 players left, which includes our Jail Officer. We now know that there are two scum left - the Blackmailer, given how Oberon died, and the Illusionist, given Julian's Janitored flip. So at this point, it's either 4-2 or 3-2-1, and I highly doubt the latter. Thankfully, both are effectively Vanilla now, so they just have an NK left. Note: that rules out a Disguiser and confirms that the Jail Officer is not the Interrogator, otherwise scum would have 4 players and this game would already be over.

As for how to proceed from here, I'm a little hesitant to have the Jail Officer out themselves yet, though that might be necessary eventually. To start, going to need a claim from Bleys now that he's a hydra.

EOD- VC

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A-Martin (4/7): A-Brand (p#1013), A-Flora (p#970), A-Caine (p#1141), A-Deirdre (p#991)

A-Flora (4/7): A-Gerard (p#649), A-Julian (p#1149), A-Martin (p#774), A-Fiona (p#980)

A-Brand (3/7): A-Random (p#215), A-Bleys (p#232), A-Oberon (p#729)

A-Bleys (1/7): A-Llewella (p#670)

Not Voting (0): None

With 12 players alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day phase ends in 2 hours.

A-Deirdre wrote:

No idea why I'm still alive. Had a whole will written out and ready to go, too. Guess I'll have to save that for later.

Yeah this is a very surprising NK.

By the by, the new post is from One Piece.

So we've got 6 players left, which includes our Jail Officer. We now know that there are two scum left - the Blackmailer, given how Oberon died, and the Illusionist, given Julian's Janitored flip. So at this point, it's either 4-2 or 3-2-1, and I highly doubt the latter. Thankfully, both are effectively Vanilla now, so they just have an NK left. Note: that rules out a Disguiser and confirms that the Jail Officer is not the Interrogator, otherwise scum would have 4 players and this game would already be over.

Excellent analysis. I think this proves Julius town.

As for how to proceed from here, I'm a little hesitant to have the Jail Officer out themselves yet, though that might be necessary eventually. To start, going to need a claim from Bleys now that he's a hydra.

I understand where you’re coming from here. If we lynch scum and no NK then that functions as a red check. If there is a NK then that is functionally a green check.

We have the mech and the Poe to win the game

As for who I'm sussing at this point, Caine and Bleys are definitely high on my list as they were for Gerard. No one's super townread, though. POE's still wide open.

this is MyLo so we need to be extremely careful with our votes

Yeah, there's a reason I'm not posting a vote at this point. Even with four votes to lynch, remember that there are still two scum in this game. Don't be cheeky about it and give them an opportunity by putting anyone at L-2.

I agree with holding off on votes. Digging last night Cain was actually a decent town lean for me from the Fiona train / D2

They were the first to push consideration on if we were in Mylo and such. They were shoving Fiona prior to the claim situation and then they hard shoved Fiona throughout the day. I think its unlikely they are Mafia bussing especially given Fiona was not pushing back on them as I typically see with theater. Fiona was appealing to them which comes more from a wolf trying to placate a town.

Brand is still pretty null

I did note D1 #1024 from Fiona digging through the flipped scum

We have less than 1 hour. I do not think the lynch will be anything but Flora or Brand. just Relax

Probably the most potentially AI post out of Fiona I grabbed skimming their ISO. This was as Fiona did shift from not voting to voting Flora so potential of distancing there. They also never shoved Brand, just took a soft stance.

Something I noted people may want to glance at and get their feelings on.

Randoms D2 looked bad to me. Their hard focus on Oberon D2 after they claimed to be killed was very odd. The initial reaction I can understand but the way they doubled down on that position felt contrived. 3 specific issues-

1- They voiced it with hardline 3p focus in a game state it was being repeated that we specifically needed to hit mafia. This lines up with a mafia mindset

2- They voiced unreasonable certainty that does not track with their reasoning saying things like "If we leave his fucker alive. I would bet my left nut hes going to hijack an account." Could be their natural hyperbole? Could also be a scum messing up how to align his conveyed certainty with faked reasoning

3- They absolutely avoided the shit out of touching the Fiona situation. I get having focus elsewhere but never touching the major day subject while hard focusing on such a random tangent? This is the most concerning thing to me. Looks like a wolf who is frozen and does not know how to deal with a team mate going down so they say nothing then just slap on a vote when its clear they are cooked for the post flip optics.

Oh, Another subject I rambled about in my last will was the Godfather/Lord of Chaos role. Important thing some probably overlooked but we should talk about-

Lord of Chaos

Description: You are a senior lord of Chaos, supervising the Chaosite incursion into the Kingdom of Amber.

Ability: You have the final say on the Mafia night actions.

Special Mechanics: When you are the last Mafia left alive, you inherit the killing ability along with one charge of whatever Mafia Killing role was alive at the start of the game. This modifier will be transferred to a random living Mafia if you die.

Other: There can never be more than one Lord of Chaos at any one time.

So Blackmailer is listed as Killing. This means if we flip the Illusionist today the Blackmailer becomes GF, Gets a night kill and a Blackmail charge they can use in the same night. Huge implications for tomorrow everyone should keep in mind. If this is forgotten by the town it could cost the game.

So if Illusionist flips expect someone to be blackmailed tomorrow. If thats you be absurdly careful following the conditions. This is my easiest break for the blackmailed person looking at the BM role conditions-

4- You cannot disable a player’s ability to vote. You may, however, ask them not to vote for a specific player (this is disabled at MyLo/LyLo).

This means the blackmailed person must say whatever but their vote may look different. The vote can not be obligated. So if you see someone shoving a player and awkwardly voting elsewhere there is your loophole.

And if your not blackmailed be careful vetting a suspected person. Forcing them to say too much could get them killed.

For giggles my desguiser code boiled down to the previous prime numbers with 25 thrown in the middle slapped into letters. Starting from M letters moved forward. so 1 was N 2 was O, 3 was P etc. Then for every 2nd letter starting from N 1 was m, 2 was l, 3 was k.

Kinda half assed it but figured it would break the AI cheating jackasses and was stupid enough nobody would even try to break my code and disguise as me (while still staying hand solvable)

Will consider later if I want to bother making one today for 3p paranoia but I am thinking no..

A-Llewella wrote:

Oh, Another subject I rambled about in my last will was the Godfather/Lord of Chaos role. Important thing some probably overlooked but we should talk about-

Lord of Chaos

Description: You are a senior lord of Chaos, supervising the Chaosite incursion into the Kingdom of Amber.

Ability: You have the final say on the Mafia night actions.

Special Mechanics: When you are the last Mafia left alive, you inherit the killing ability along with one charge of whatever Mafia Killing role was alive at the start of the game. This modifier will be transferred to a random living Mafia if you die.

Other: There can never be more than one Lord of Chaos at any one time.

So Blackmailer is listed as Killing. This means if we flip the Illusionist today the Blackmailer becomes GF, Gets a night kill and a Blackmail charge they can use in the same night. Huge implications for tomorrow everyone should keep in mind. If this is forgotten by the town it could cost the game.

I flagged that Lord of Chaos mechanic earlier, but I don’t understand how it’s still in play or why specifically killing the Illusionist results in the Blackmailer getting an extra charge. My reading of the role is that you have to be the Lord of Chaos and the last scum left alive to get the charge. This would satisfy neither of those requirements unless the Blackmailer somehow inherits the Lord of Chaos role. If I missed something about that, please point it out.

I’ll look through your reads later.

A-Deirdre wrote:

I flagged that Lord of Chaos mechanic earlier, but I don’t understand how it’s still in play or why specifically killing the Illusionist results in the Blackmailer getting an extra charge. My reading of the role is that you have to be the Lord of Chaos and the last scum left alive to get the charge. This would satisfy neither of those requirements unless the Blackmailer somehow inherits the Lord of Chaos role. If I missed something about that, please point it out.

I’ll look through your reads later.

The way I am reading it is that the GodFather mechanic gets passed on.

'if' there are 3 mafia

GF dies D2. One of the two remaining becomes GF. No big deal

Today we have Blackmailer + Illusionist, eliminating specifically Illusionist promotes Blackmailer to GF.

The Blackmailer getting +1 charge of Blackmail/Kill is something to keep in mind. Thats the potential

I could be reading this wrong. A lot of things going on there at once. But I figured its worth putting it in everyones minds and openly talking about now for a few reasons.

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Not Voting (6): A-Bleys, A-Brand, A-Caine, A-Deirdre, A-Llewella, A-Random

With 6 players alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day phase ends in 2 days, 16 hours.

A-Llewella wrote:

A-Deirdre wrote:

I flagged that Lord of Chaos mechanic earlier, but I don’t understand how it’s still in play or why specifically killing the Illusionist results in the Blackmailer getting an extra charge. My reading of the role is that you have to be the Lord of Chaos and the last scum left alive to get the charge. This would satisfy neither of those requirements unless the Blackmailer somehow inherits the Lord of Chaos role. If I missed something about that, please point it out.

I’ll look through your reads later.

The way I am reading it is that the GodFather mechanic gets passed on.

'if' there are 3 mafia

GF dies D2. One of the two remaining becomes GF. No big deal

Today we have Blackmailer + Illusionist, eliminating specifically Illusionist promotes Blackmailer to GF.

The Blackmailer getting +1 charge of Blackmail/Kill is something to keep in mind. Thats the potential

I could be reading this wrong. A lot of things going on there at once. But I figured its worth putting it in everyones minds and openly talking about now for a few reasons.

I think these are good points. The problem is if we ML today there’s a strong chance we lose on the spot.

This is also worth noting

Description: You are a noble Amberite in charge of a wing of the castle dungeon, discreetly detaining suspects and gathering information on behalf of the Crown.

Ability: Pick a target during the DAY to jail. They will be removed from all chats for that night, be roleblocked, and become immune to all night attacks. You gain a one-night anonymous night chat with your captive.

Once per game, you may optionally execute your captive, killing them.

Jailing is a perfect roleblock, meaning that it roleblocks roles that are normally immune to roleblock.

If a mafia member is jailed then the team will know and the one who isn’t jailed can just submit the NK. Ergo town has no way of stopping the NK

Hold up let me check something

Mag,

if the godfather is dead does one mafia member become the new godfather and is assigned the NK or can any mafia submit the NK?

The way I am reading it is that the GodFather mechanic gets passed on.

'if' there are 3 mafia

GF dies D2. One of the two remaining becomes GF. No big deal

Today we have Blackmailer + Illusionist, eliminating specifically Illusionist promotes Blackmailer to GF.

The Blackmailer getting +1 charge of Blackmail/Kill is something to keep in mind. Thats the potential

I could be reading this wrong. A lot of things going on there at once. But I figured its worth putting it in everyones minds and openly talking about now for a few reasons.

I'm reading back through everything I can find on the Lord of Chaos this morning. Magoroth said back in DP1 that the Lord of Chaos is the only role that can execute the factional kill for Mafia. Also, I apparently can't read because the role says "This modifier will be transferred to a random living Mafia if you die," so yes, someone else has it. I will note, however, that it doesn't matter which member of the Mafia team we lynch today because regardless of who that is, the other will get this role and, if I'm reading it correctly, will get a shot of the Blackmailer. Where it gets confusing is that the roles says they "inherit the killing ability," which the Blackmailer would already be, but I'm guessing they'd just get an additional shot whereas the Illusionist would get the role and the shot.

@Magoroth could you confirm that that's how it works?

A-Deirdre wrote:

The way I am reading it is that the GodFather mechanic gets passed on.

'if' there are 3 mafia

GF dies D2. One of the two remaining becomes GF. No big deal

Today we have Blackmailer + Illusionist, eliminating specifically Illusionist promotes Blackmailer to GF.

The Blackmailer getting +1 charge of Blackmail/Kill is something to keep in mind. Thats the potential

I could be reading this wrong. A lot of things going on there at once. But I figured its worth putting it in everyones minds and openly talking about now for a few reasons.

I'm reading back through everything I can find on the Lord of Chaos this morning. Magoroth said back in DP1 that the Lord of Chaos is the only role that can execute the factional kill for Mafia. Also, I apparently can't read because the role says "This modifier will be transferred to a random living Mafia if you die," so yes, someone else has it. I will note, however, that it doesn't matter which member of the Mafia team we lynch today because regardless of who that is, the other will get this role and, if I'm reading it correctly, will get a shot of the Blackmailer. Where it gets confusing is that the roles says they "inherit the killing ability," which the Blackmailer would already be, but I'm guessing they'd just get an additional shot whereas the Illusionist would get the role and the shot.

@Magoroth could you confirm that that's how it works?

I must’ve been drunk when I said that. Anyone can perform the factional kill

This is also worth noting

Description: You are a noble Amberite in charge of a wing of the castle dungeon, discreetly detaining suspects and gathering information on behalf of the Crown.

Ability: Pick a target during the DAY to jail. They will be removed from all chats for that night, be roleblocked, and become immune to all night attacks. You gain a one-night anonymous night chat with your captive.

Once per game, you may optionally execute your captive, killing them.

Jailing is a perfect roleblock, meaning that it roleblocks roles that are normally immune to roleblock.

If a mafia member is jailed then the team will know and the one who isn’t jailed can just submit the NK. Ergo town has no way of stopping the NK

This would be a fair point if we hadn't already been told that the Lord of Chaos is the only player who can execute on an NK. We were outright told that if the Lord of Chaos is jailed, there is no NK, so you were right that successfully preventing an NK is a red check.