Jim Carrey Mafia DP1

Originally Posted by wylted on 11/4/2026 at 2:09 PM (post #148)

rex claimed miller late into the DP after giving everyone time not to claim miller. like it's not that big of a deal to think he would fake claim it

Idk, Banana hadn't posted yet. But point taken.

And now I dive into the records to see if there has ever been a town Bus Driver.

Alright, some quick reads since I've been gone all day.

Thoth - I don't like him much behaviorally, but those times also tend to be the ones where I put light townreads on him and this is no different. I feel like he's been a bit more defensive of the whole push for massclaiming roles (I get that he more suggested open discussion of it, but he's been largely supportive of its pursuit) than he should be, but I also think Thoth is more likely to claim under the kind of pressure he's gotten if he's scum than town. It's not a strong read, especially given that scum didn't get a fake role claim this game, but Thoth has thrown out some pretty big swings as scum before and I don't think that would stop him. I'm hesitant to give it more than a gut townread, though.

Pie - Not a lot to go off of so far. The joke vote on Wylted followed by the vote on Thoth entirely on the basis that he's not great at fake claiming would be opportunistic from virtually anyone, but it's not unusual for Pie. I'm tempted to townread his last couple of posts as he comes to the realization that the Miller claim is likely real, though it's not really enough to sway me off of a null read yet.

Wryly - I'm largely null on Wryly with some slight town vibes. I can largely see the pattern that Helz is laying out with Wryly's posting, though #28 comes off as more kicking the tires on the idea and encouraging a bit of back and forth with it. And I can also see Wryly's point on the Miller claim, which is something I've pointed out as well. I don't think Wryly's specifically dismissing the possibility that Rex would do this, rather that it's an appropriate risk for virtually anyone (with exceptions) to take, at least insofar as we've seen players take it on this site. Yeah, it's analysis of common site meta, but I think it's valid here. I wouldn't say it gives me a solid reason to townread Wryly, but I can at least get a bead on Wryly's thinking and that makes me want to lean town a bit.

Magoroth - Slight scum. It's basically down to his last two posts, which are the only ones that contribute an opinion so far. Wonky choice to say that he wants a mass claim delayed to DP2 without much explanation beyond it possibly ending the game DP1 (unclear why he thinks that) before questioning the entire basis for seeking a mass claim at all. It's "both sides"ing the issue while also delaying any implementation. It's not a lot to go off of, but then he hasn't really posted enough for me to make any other inferences.

Wylted - Perhaps a little quick on the jump with the mass role claim idea while also shunting to push Mago for some reason. That's not really what bothers me, though. I get pushing Thoth, too, though it seems a little weird that, after jumping in and saying that the mass claim is an idea he supports, he's going after Thoth for being the one who suggested it. He embraced it before Thoth did, and it feels a little disingenuous, even if Thoth started the idea. I also really don't like his continued efforts to push against townreading the Miller claim. I get that the claim came later in the DP, but it seems like Wylted's ignoring the risks of the claim regardless of whether it came up at the beginning of the DP or in the middle. Slight scum.

Helz - Largely based on the extensive reads and how Helz is going about looking through everyone so far, I'm putting them as slight town. Not really any strong read there because I know Helz can come up with reads like this and be detailed and thorough in the analysis, particularly this early, but I follow the logic pretty well and see the progression of how Helz is viewing everyone's posts so far. Usually townread that shit, no different here.

Banana - Null. Just not a lot to read into so far. Said she's not opposed to the mass role claim with a caveat about interpretation, then just said we have to make a decision on the mass claim soon. It's not a very solid position one way or the other, and though I think a role claim from her might help me situate her better, I don't think that's reason enough for me to push her for a claim now.

Rex - Lean town. I've already explained how I see the Miller claim and why I don't think scum would play this the way he has. The late-ish claim also gives him a small amount of towncred IMO, just seems like an odd way to act given that it would immediately invite questions. I just don't think Rex takes this kind of risk as scum.

So yeah, right now, I'm tempted to get a claim from Wylted.

VTL Wylted

Originally Posted by Thoth on 11/4/2026 at 2:46 PM (post #149)

Me am Bus Driver

Umm... huh. That's borderline SOP. I guess to some degree it depends on how you perceive it, since I wouldn't say a Redirector is SOP, but I'd at least consider SOP claiming this and probably would've made motions about doing so.

Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/4/2026 at 2:50 PM (post #152)

And now I dive into the records to see if there has ever been a town Bus Driver.

I think I recall one, but it's way back, like late DDO/early DART.

The only Bus Drivers I can find were in Ranger's Apprentice mafia and Andor mafia. Scum roles both time. This in itself isn't evidence of guilt; I merely take note that it is a manipulative role that I've never seen given to town, and should be treated like Redirector or Strengthener: something that could potentially just be scum passing off their real role as a town role.

Originally Posted by whiteflame on 11/4/2026 at 3:10 PM (post #155)

Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/4/2026 at 2:50 PM (post #152)

And now I dive into the records to see if there has ever been a town Bus Driver.

I think I recall one, but it's way back, like late DDO/early DART.

Alas for the lost records.

Not Strengthener whoops lol

Originally Posted by Wryly on 11/4/2026 at 3:10 PM (post #156)

The only Bus Drivers I can find were in Ranger's Apprentice mafia and Andor mafia. Scum roles both time. This in itself isn't evidence of guilt; I merely take note that it is a manipulative role that I've never seen given to town, and should be treated like Redirector or Strengthener: something that could potentially just be scum passing off their real role as a town role.

I think you meant Roleblocker, but yes. It also wouldn't be out of the ordinary for Thoth to take a big swing and claim something out of the ordinary in the hopes that we think it's just crazy enough to be real. Going to need to think on this one.

Automated Vote Count

This system-generated vote count was posted on behalf of the main host.

Thoth (3/5): ILikePie5 (p#48), RexFavilla (p#52), wylted (p#119)

wylted (1/5): Banana (p#81)

Not Voting (5): Magoroth, whiteflame, Wryly (p#136), Thoth, Helz

With 9 players alive, the base elimination threshold is 5. Configured role modifiers may change vote power or an individual player's threshold. Day phase ends in 21 hours.
Day phase ends: (your local time).

What's mainly bothering me is the lack of breadcrumbing on Thoth's part prior to the claim. Look at the past two games where he was town.

In the State Attorneys General game, he breadcrumbed that he'd received info about his role that wasn't what he expected.

In the Apocalypse game, he mentioned there was something about his PM that indicated a lie in the OP.

I don't recall him giving any breadcrumbs for his role in the Epstein Island game. I find it odd he wouldn't at least have mentioned something about his role this game, given that it's very often a scum role, especially after so many people started pushing him for a claim. I can understand being reticent about it at least, so that could explain why he held off as long as he did, but it could also be that he was still figuring out what to claim.

Originally Posted by whiteflame on 11/4/2026 at 3:31 PM (post #161)

I don't recall him giving any breadcrumbs for his role in the Epstein Island game. I find it odd he wouldn't at least have mentioned something about his role this game, given that it's very often a scum role, especially after so many people started pushing him for a claim. I can understand being reticent about it at least, so that could explain why he held off as long as he did, but it could also be that he was still figuring out what to claim.

My initial thought was a panicked straight claim as pressure builds. Also outside his normal operating hours - scum mate pestering him about pressure building?

Automated Vote Count

This system-generated vote count was posted on behalf of the main host.

Thoth (3/5): ILikePie5 (p#48), RexFavilla (p#52), wylted (p#119)

wylted (1/5): Banana (p#81)

Not Voting (5): Magoroth, whiteflame, Wryly (p#136), Thoth, Helz

With 9 players alive, the base elimination threshold is 5. Configured role modifiers may change vote power or an individual player's threshold. Day phase ends in 21 hours.
Day phase ends: (your local time).

Originally Posted by RexFavilla on 11/4/2026 at 3:33 PM (post #162)

Originally Posted by whiteflame on 11/4/2026 at 3:31 PM (post #161)

I don't recall him giving any breadcrumbs for his role in the Epstein Island game. I find it odd he wouldn't at least have mentioned something about his role this game, given that it's very often a scum role, especially after so many people started pushing him for a claim. I can understand being reticent about it at least, so that could explain why he held off as long as he did, but it could also be that he was still figuring out what to claim.

My initial thought was a panicked straight claim as pressure builds. Also outside his normal operating hours - scum mate pestering him about pressure building?

Yeah, I'm thinking about the timing, too.

Originally Posted by whiteflame on 11/4/2026 at 2:07 PM (post #154)

Originally Posted by Thoth on 11/4/2026 at 2:46 PM (post #149)

Me am Bus Driver

Umm... huh. That's borderline SOP. I guess to some degree it depends on how you perceive it, since I wouldn't say a Redirector is SOP, but I'd at least consider SOP claiming this and probably would've made motions about doing so.

Why SOP? It’s not Compulsive

Well it might be, lemme ask

And in both cases there was a remarkable oddity to bring up. Maybe I should get in the habit of breadcrumbing every game

Originally Posted by Thoth on 11/4/2026 at 3:42 PM (post #166)

Originally Posted by whiteflame on 11/4/2026 at 2:07 PM (post #154)

Originally Posted by Thoth on 11/4/2026 at 2:46 PM (post #149)

Me am Bus Driver

Umm... huh. That's borderline SOP. I guess to some degree it depends on how you perceive it, since I wouldn't say a Redirector is SOP, but I'd at least consider SOP claiming this and probably would've made motions about doing so.

Why SOP? It’s not Compulsive

So you wouldn't have used it? And I say it's borderline SOP because it's far more commonly a scum role. Redirectors and Roleblockers are often enough on both sides of the coin, but I can barely even recall an instance where a Bus Driver was and the role is largely negative utility. I get that being compulsive would've made it absolutely SOP, but I think it's odd that you didn't even consider it as possibly SOP.

Originally Posted by Thoth on 11/4/2026 at 3:44 PM (post #169)

And in both cases there was a remarkable oddity to bring up. Maybe I should get in the habit of breadcrumbing every game

I'll admit those cases were outliers, I just think this case looks pretty out there as well. Maybe your experience is different from mine.

Originally Posted by wylted on 11/4/2026 at 3:43 PM (post #168)

you are mischaracterizing my criticism of Thoth.

my statement was that the first one to suggest a mass role claim should be willing to give their claim first, not that it makes somebody scummy to suggest it.

your other observations of me are fair so no push back there.

Fair point.

My first instinct would be to press for a full claim with an iffy role like that, but in these circumstances that may hurt us more than it helps.

wya

^ u

Town busdriver also makes a game this small incredibly swingy.

DP1 5:2

Lynch

NP1 5:1 - at this point the BD has a 1/6 chance of busdriving the remaining scum and the NK ending the game

NK

DP2 4:1

Mislynch

NP2 3:1 - at this point the BD has 1 1/3 chance of busdriving the last scum and the kill target, ending the game

If the busdriver survives the game becomes incredibly risky for scum. If they have some strong counter to the role it's pointless as a town role. It's different than the redirector because the reditector has to manipulate actions in the right direction, essentially doubling the odds for scum. If they redirect the NK target to the surviving scum, it doesn't end the game. All the busdriver has to do is target both the target and the killer and it doesn't matter, the game is over.

Originally Posted by RexFavilla on 11/4/2026 at 4:40 PM (post #177)

Town busdriver also makes a game this small incredibly swingy.

DP1 5:2

Lynch

NP1 5:1 - at this point the BD has a 1/6 chance of busdriving the remaining scum and the NK ending the game

NK

DP2 4:1

Mislynch

NP2 3:1 - at this point the BD has 1 1/3 chance of busdriving the last scum and the kill target, ending the game

If the busdriver survives the game becomes incredibly risky for scum. If they have some strong counter to the role it's pointless as a town role. It's different than the redirector because the reditector has to manipulate actions in the right direction, essentially doubling the odds for scum. If they redirect the NK target to the surviving scum, it doesn't end the game. All the busdriver has to do is target both the target and the killer and it doesn't matter, the game is over.

Basically if there is a town busdriver, and we lynch scum DP1, and the busdriver survives two more DPs, the remaining scum has an around 50% chance of the NK and themselves being switched and outright losing the game. That's very very swingy,

Ya I’m fine lynching thoth

Originally Posted by Wryly on 04/11/2026 at 22:02 (post #174)

^ u

Sorry, I’ll try to be more active the upcoming days. I’m tired as fuck, worked 7 days in a row and now I’m back at it again.. had a day off two days ago. Just be kind pls