Periodic Table of Elements Mafia - DP2

Lunatic wrote:

If I am picking up what is being put down correctly Mikal can vouch for you, can you vouch for him like he claims? If so I’d potentially be willing to cross him off the list for the dreamer results here and focus on bullish. But I would need you to be fairly confident.

So I'm still trying to work out some of the details, honestly. A lot happened I'm still trying to sort it out, waiting for some answers from Pie on that front. Can't say I solidly townread him, but I have more reason to townread him than not.

For now, suffice it to say I made a choice during the NP that seems to have had some pretty complex consequences. I'll be more forthcoming about all this once I've got it sorted.

Update

Wf and I are in a chat together and talking

We did not start the chat. So figured the mason portion of that would lock. We both are not masons. Someone put us there

We both have redirection style roles

A bunch of fuckery happened so trying to iron out exactly the ooe before we say in full.

Have to confirm who I hit. High chance caset could be lying but I think pie took a wrong action from me instead of the one I intended. Waiting to confirm which he used and then we at least have info

Yeah I’m probably cooked lol, being on results after lynching ago is not a great look. And my claim is not going to help my either. I am krypton, the compulsive hider. I hid behind Rex last night.

Could you elaborate on the specifics of how your Hider works? You mentioned later that you don't die hiding behind scum. How does it affect anyone who targets you during the NP?

whiteflame wrote:

Yeah I’m probably cooked lol, being on results after lynching ago is not a great look. And my claim is not going to help my either. I am krypton, the compulsive hider. I hid behind Rex last night.

Could you elaborate on the specifics of how your Hider works? You mentioned later that you don't die hiding behind scum. How does it affect anyone who targets you during the NP?

Pie was being wierd about answering that, told me I needed to be very specific. I asked him about the following scum roles, roleblock, silencer, scout, lookout, lawyer, framer, redirector could all target me. I assume the fact that he made be be so specific means there is potentially a role out there that couldn’t target me, but he won’t tell me what role that would be unless I ask it specifically.

That or he is just being extra careful and making me jump through hoops to be safe he doesn’t mod slip something.

Mikal wrote:

Update

Wf and I are in a chat together and talking

We did not start the chat. So figured the mason portion of that would lock. We both are not masons. Someone put us there

We both have redirection style roles

A bunch of fuckery happened so trying to iron out exactly the ooe before we say in full.

Have to confirm who I hit. High chance caset could be lying but I think pie took a wrong action from me instead of the one I intended. Waiting to confirm which he used and then we at least have info

Are you confirming each other on the basis of being in a chat with each other or is there something else? If someone put you in a chat together that makes it less likely you are both confirmed.

Did you do anything last night?

We agree with this. We both thought the other was a mason.

Where is at im cobat and can magnetize people. I targeted luna because I thought he was scum and was debating about moving him to casey or wf [wf cus i was listening to magics thiughts and was teetering]

Was going back and forth. It looks like pie took my final thoughts and I moved luna to wf

White targeted luna and can move all actions to himself. So basically I moved wf to himself.

Wf also got hit with a vanillaizer

We agree with this. We both thought the other was a mason.

Where is at im cobat and can magnetize people. I targeted luna because I thought he was scum and was debating about moving him to casey or wf [wf cus i was listening to magics thiughts and was teetering]

Was going back and forth. It looks like pie took my final thoughts and I moved luna to wf

White targeted luna and can move all actions to himself. So basically I moved wf to himself.

Wf also got hit with a vanillaizer

Waiting on pie to confirm cus I was swapping between wf and Casey as the redirect target. He thumbs up wf so assuming thats what he took. But if he took casey then casey could be lying if they had results

White targeted luna and can move all actions to himself. So basically I moved wf to himself.

WF did not visit Luna or himself. He visited Shining.

Lunatic wrote:

whiteflame wrote:

Yeah I’m probably cooked lol, being on results after lynching ago is not a great look. And my claim is not going to help my either. I am krypton, the compulsive hider. I hid behind Rex last night.

Could you elaborate on the specifics of how your Hider works? You mentioned later that you don't die hiding behind scum. How does it affect anyone who targets you during the NP?

Pie was being wierd about answering that, told me I needed to be very specific. I asked him about the following scum roles, roleblock, silencer, scout, lookout, lawyer, framer, redirector could all target me. I assume the fact that he made be be so specific means there is potentially a role out there that couldn’t target me, but he won’t tell me what role that would be unless I ask it specifically.

That or he is just being extra careful and making me jump through hoops to be safe he doesn’t mod slip something.

Not often I've seen a Hider who can be targeted by so many roles, just not night kills apparently. If there's something else that can't target you, we probably won't learn what it is.

RexFavilla wrote:

White targeted luna and can move all actions to himself. So basically I moved wf to himself.

WF did not visit Luna or himself. He visited Shining.

That is... huh. Only way that happens is if I got redirected or deflected.

Maybe mafia has a deflect. But we just spent an hour going over this. And he seemed genuine.

What tech should have happened is he should have been moved to himself [low chance casey if pie took that]

Not sure how that happens with a vanillaixer though

How did you see him going to amyone if he got vanillized though

Mikal wrote:

How did you see him going to amyone if he got vanillized though

I see three possibilities.

1. He's lying about one or many things.

2. I was somehow redirected to someone else who I saw visit Shining

3. His night action processed simultaneously with the vannilaization and was somehow misdirected.

My experience with the Vanillaizer role is that it doesn't function as an RB for the night it's used. It effectively just turns you Vanilla for all future nights.

I was initially sus of two redirecting mechanisms being in the same game but was entertaining it cus of the vanilliazer from a role balance perspective

Its more odd if he is going to someone i didnt move him too when he was vanillized. To note he said he was vanillized after I claimed. Was an inadvertent cc of sorts as far as both being forms of misdirection

Def think mafia have a lot of roles that can fuck with stuff

Or he could be lying all around and I just moved luna to him and he did something to shinning.

We are discussing his post above but there is a lot of chaos

Just some thoughts on how the NP could have played out given what we know.

Scum killed Kohai. Either Helz is lying about protecting him or scum used some role to pierce the protection Helz provided.

Scum Vanillaized me. If Rex is right that I visited Shining, then they either were trying to Vanillaize Shining or me, and they used some kind of redirection role on me simultaneous to that, which suggests they were trying to Vanillaize Shining. If I visited Luna as planned, they either Vanillaized Luna or me and either Rex is lying or some fuckery happened with his role.

Mikal wrote:

We agree with this. We both thought the other was a mason.

Where is at im cobat and can magnetize people. I targeted luna because I thought he was scum and was debating about moving him to casey or wf [wf cus i was listening to magics thiughts and was teetering]

Was going back and forth. It looks like pie took my final thoughts and I moved luna to wf

White targeted luna and can move all actions to himself. So basically I moved wf to himself.

Wf also got hit with a vanillaizer

I am so confused, trying to process this lol

Mikal wrote:

We agree with this. We both thought the other was a mason.

Where is at im cobat and can magnetize people. I targeted luna because I thought he was scum and was debating about moving him to casey or wf [wf cus i was listening to magics thiughts and was teetering]

Was going back and forth. It looks like pie took my final thoughts and I moved luna to wf

White targeted luna and can move all actions to himself. So basically I moved wf to himself.

Wf also got hit with a vanillaizer

I am so confused, trying to process this lol

First glance is that in retrospect, Mikal still seems town. I don’t seee the point in trying to shift the wagon away from Magoroth there from the pov of scum Lunatic.

As for the mechanics standpoint of what happened last night, gimme a sec. I’m gonna theorycraft if all the interactions in the night make sense.

Once we get some questions answered by Pie, we can address some of the uncertainties involved in what happened. It'll probably still be a mess, but at the very least, we should be able to disentangle some of it.

Mag1cman wrote:

First glance is that in retrospect, Mikal still seems town. I don’t seee the point in trying to shift the wagon away from Magoroth there from the pov of scum Lunatic.

*scum Mikal

As for scum Lunativ, the only way he shifts the wagon away from Casey is if Casey is scum, I think.

There is however an additional layer of WIFOM in both cases, not wanting to be on the wagon of mislynched town, which I will deep dive later to find out if this WIFOM tinfoil has any real ground to stand on

Lunatic wrote:

So what are your thought on a strengthener and roleblocker-esque role being in the same team? Why or why wouldn’t pie do that as a mod? Curious to see your take on this.

Catching up but I really have no idea what Kohai was on about with them CCing. It makes perfect sense to me the same as a doctor and a Vigilante existing. One role prevents actions in general. The other allows bypassing prevention and redirectives and such. If anything I think the strengthener in general is an odd role for town to have and makes more sense for scum but I do not see it as possible for Mags flip to be false.

I do have the bias of absolutely knowing both exist as town but trying to put myself outside of that perspective I struggle to see what Kohai was even seeing there.

RexFavilla wrote:

If we mislynch three times we lose so dreamer results are a bit iffy to me.

My thoughts are in line with that which is why in every world I see Casey is included in the PoE they created. Of the 4 Luna feels like the most likely to be town although their role of hider is perfect for scum.

I do still want to unpack the D1 train progression more.

So what we know so far based on what was claimed.

I hide behind Rex.

Helz roleblocks anyone that visits kohai. Kohai still dies.

Someone put whiteflame and mikal in a pm.

Rex either tracked or watched whiteflame and saw him visit shining.

Mikal magentized me moving my hide onto whiteflame.

Whiteflame moved me to himself.

Whiteflame got vanillized.

Did any of whiteflames actions even count if he was vanillized?

https://tenor.com/view/calculating-alan-the-hangover-math-zach-galifianakis-gif-3949555410039842380

So many things to factor in here too, as in who is lying about what, and how would we know.