Just need two more!
Just need two more!
I'll submit the result
I think you'll be fine, I picked it up quick
Not vanilla
You helped me balance this one, if you forgot absolutely everything then you can play though. Otherwise I may want your help making sure I don't screw up modding this.
Ping
Welcome to Andor Mafia! This game is based on the Star Wars prequel show to Rogue One. As in my previous game, there will be no night phases, and any night actions will need to be locked in in advance. Further game details will be announced when the first day phase starts.
1. whiteflame
2. RexFavilla
3. Kohai
4. Skipper
5. Magoroth
6. wylted
7. Banana
8. Wryly
9. Thoth
I'll submit the results
I'll submit the results.
It's possible to include DART, but I'm not sure that would be fair since ELO wasn't being recorded on DART.
Oh I thought you meant the last time people weren't signing up.
if no one’s signing up, then yeah.
Cant remember the last time the community did this
Well, it's happening now. But just because people are burned out on mafia.
Has anyone done Andor as a theme yet? If not I'll probably go with that.
Put me in line to host again. I'll try to do something less swingy this time lol.
I really like this concept.
I wanted to have a game for a while where everyone was the same character, this theme ended up being the best way to justify that as a punchline.
I like a lot of the mechanics of this game, and hope to see it used again.
Which part? The trigger word concept, or something else?
I do think we should get a policy in place for replacements though.
My policy so far has been hoping it's rare enough not to affect the scores too much. But there's probably a better way, like treating them together as a single player and splitting the gain/loss. Could say that leaving early is just an auto loss for that player, but that seems a bit harsh and kind of penalizes their team if there's no replacement.
if you had 2 mafia wins compared to someone who had two town wins my assumption is that the mafia wins would weigh significantly more
That's correct. Keeps total elo balanced, and also I think it's more telling how you perform when there are fewer other team members to dilute your ability. This kind of expects that you perform similarly as scum and as town, which feels necessary if we're going to have a single elo score. It may be an oversimplification, but if I need to change the system later, I can retroactively rescore everyone so it's consistent.
a player's Elo rating is equivalent to their expected winrate against a player whose Elo rating is a certain amount relative to theirs, e.g., 150 points lower or 300 points higher. Since Mafia is a team game with a large random component, I doubt that any player will ever have a win-rate above a certain percentage that's nowhere close to 100%.
Elo here is actually an estimation of the winrate of a team with an average elo of some value. So if I'm 1600 and you are 1500, it estimates that a team made of me and other people at my skill level would beat a team of you and others at your skill level a certain amount.
So isn't the possible Elo range effectively restricted to a few hundred points on either side of 1500?
I'd expect so if opponents are just random. However, once the spread gets large enough, we may start having people play rated against others with similar elo. That could allow for a bigger range of scores. There's also a decent amount to be gained by carrying a team of others with low elo (which allows your elo to rise faster). But your team is basically random, so you should expect to be paired up with people of average elo within the group.
My personal view is that I think we'll be able to assess the results better after 20-30 games, but the results seem to make more "sense" than I would have expected at this point, I guess. I considered having player votes on performance, but while I think this would improve short-term results, it introduces other sources of bias that I think are more likely to be avoided long-term in a system that only rewards wins/penalizes losses. It's also difficult to noob snipe, because in contrast to debating, there's a lot more people in each game, and you have to play a lot of games to improve your score significantly.
What are your general thoughts, and what do you expect the rankings to be after some large number of games—say, after 100 games or so?
I didn't know who was going to be on top, but Pie makes sense to me. I expect him to stay pretty high up (even if an 83% winrate likely isn't sustainable). The gap between him and the second-place spot on the leaderboard seems telling even this early on. I think Mikal and Lunatic are underrated at the moment (just got unlucky with the small sample size) and will end up at least above average. As a general rule, I think experienced players being consistently at the top will be a sign that the system is becoming more accurate. As for how they'll rank against each other, I think that's harder to predict.
Surprised we only had a roleblock
I guess I expected your role to be more OP and less of a liability than it ended up being. Probably should have given you more in retrospect. I thought giving everyone the same character would hurt the town, as well as messing up the wording in some town players' PMs for their win condition and character description to throw some people off. When most people had you in their town block, I thought you had a shot. But Avenger was a very powerful role for town to have.
Well, technically not a switcher since Pie still died. But basically the same thing in this case.
Endgame up!
TOWN WIN
1st Place: Vader, Mag1cman, Shining, RexFavilla, ILikePie5, whiteflame, Airmax1227
2nd Place: Wryly, Mikal
KOHAI: So, you have a new mafia endgame for me?
SAVANT: Yes, sir, I do. It's called Ryan George Cinematic Universe Mafia Endgame.
KOHAI: And what game is it for?
SAVANT: The only one that makes sense given the title.
KOHAI: So, what players were in this game?
SAVANT: Well, there's Pie, and Mharman.
KOHAI: They're on the top of the leaderboard!
SAVANT: They sure are, sir.
KOAHI: And what did they do to help catch the mafia?
SAVANT: Well, they lynched a town player, and one of them died the first night.
KOHAI: ...and?
SAVANT: Well, that's two things.
KOAHI: It seems like it must have been pretty hard for the town to win the game if one of the best players got killed the first night.
SAVANT: Actually, it was super easy, barely an inconvenience.
KOHAI: Oh, really?
SAVANT: See, one of the scum players said a trigger word they were told would kill them. And one of the town players who can avenge someone's death picked the same person that scum targeted on the first night.
KOHAI: Why would a scum player say a word they were told would kill them at the beginning of the game?
SAVANT: So that the game can happen.
KOHAI: That works.
SAVANT: We also have this other player who dies on the first day. Shining.
KOHAI: Shining? What's his deal?
SAVANT: He was in the game!
KOHAI: Wow wow wow....wow.
SAVANT: So, what do you think?
KOHAI: Well, I think as long as we really lean into the meta angle with this endgame writeup, people might overlook the extremely swingy setup, borderline unfair mod tactics, and all the alternative ways this role setup could have gone wrong.
Role PMs and Night Actions:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ZBrxf_e896nIFcKoTWrWGYExRjer0sNq5chHQmAvtxw/edit?usp=sharing
Vote Count
Airmax1227 (1/5) Mikal
Shining (5/5) whiteflame, Vader, Pie, Mharman, Mikal
Shining was lynched. They were innocent! DP2 coming shortly.
As stated in the original post: to go to the next day phase, you must lynch a player.
Vote Count
Airmax1227 (1/5) Mikal
Whiteflame (1/5) Pie
With 8 alive it takes 5 to lynch!
Living Players:
1. Airmax1227
2. RexFavilla
3. Shining
4. Mikal
5. whiteflame
6. Mag1cman
7. ILikePie5
8. Vader
Wryly has died for unexplained reasons! They were guilty. The day phase has not yet ended.
Let the mafia game begin!
KOHAI: So, you have a new mafia game for me?
SAVANT: Yes, sir, I do. It’s based on a YouTube sketch artist called Ryan George.
KOHAI: That does sound like a person’s name. So, what’s gonna happen in this game? Do you have anything cool planned for the night phase?
SAVANT: Actually, sir, there’s not going to be any night phases.
KOHAI: Oh, really?
SAVANT: Yeah, see, players are just going to lock in different versions of their night actions ahead of time based on different possible ways the day phase could end.
KOHAI: Players love it when new and inexperienced moderators introduce confusing rules.
SAVANT: They sure do, sir. We’re also going to have a time limit for the whole game instead of for each day phase so the whole thing doesn’t take too long. Each day can be as long as people want.
KOHAI: Is that how days work in the real world?
SAVANT: It might be. So, what do you think?
KOHAI: Well, I think as long as we don’t follow up this dialogue with a list of intentionally vague additional rules, people won’t be too confused.
Game Information
Unique Mechanics
Rules
If you have any questions, please PM me. I will answer questions about your role and dead players’ roles, but not about hypothetical roles.
Living Players:
1. Airmax1227
2. RexFavilla
3. Shining
4. Mikal
5. whiteflame
6. Mag1cman
7. Wryly
8. ILikePie5
9. Vader
With 9 players alive it takes 5 to lynch.
PMs going out now
If you want to play Thoth's game as well, I recommend signing up now. That way there's no delay between the end of this game and the beginning of that one.