whiteflame

If whiteflame does say how his role works, I might be able to clear him, but that will depend on the role. With mean anti-claim mechanics publicly known to exist, it might be better that he does not. I guess if he is 100% the elimination today, he might as well tell us during twilight.

If I say how my role works, given what I've already indicated about it, that will just give away what my role is. At that point, I might as well claim. I'm not expecting you or anyone else to clear me without claiming, so I respect that I'm still in a lot of scum piles.

I'm not sure why you'd mention my telling you during the twilight phase, either. Anti-claim would likely be in effect during the NP. I'll claim early next DP.

I'm home. Gimme a sec to catch up on the last page worth of posts and then I'll make my decision.

Yeah... I'm getting set to leave work and I'm not sure where to put my vote here. Have to figure it out, though.

My mistake, thought there were more votes on Vader but most of them are still on Awesome.

Noticing that the votes you have listed are mostly on Awesome despite them actually being on Vader.

Debating if this is a bluff.

Same. Looks pretty genuine, but I could see him pulling something like this as scum as a last ditch effort.

If I end up being the hammer (as I may well be at this point), it'll be before the end of the workday here, so less than 2 hours from now. I can't say I'm writing off Awesome yet, so I'd like some responses to the questions that have been posed to him before then.

Alright, that's 4 votes so far, plus Luna's makes 5.

Where are we at on the Vader vote count?

I will say that my role pm was screwed up but it’s actually insane how people think I would go that angle if I was scum

Please explain what you meant by this. What elements of your PM were “screwed up”?

Idk both feel like mislynches to me though.

If you have another option, I'm open to discussing it. We do have to make a decision, though.

Doesnt confirm his affiliation though. And there’s still the question of the lack of win con in his PM. My theory is that as scum, he probably has an ability to disable chats, or it’s some sort of anti claim feature

Could be. I can't say I'm townreading him off of his claim alone.

Has Supa ever raged out before being lynched like that as scum? The two games I can recall him being scum in he just kind of sadly withered away and died once he thought it was hopeless.

It's been a while since I've played with him as scum, but it wouldn't be the first time I've seen him rage quit as scum or town.

Awesome, if he can't turn off chats at will and needs to die to do it, at least has positive utility even if he ends up being town so he's the safer option mechanically. And his flip reveals info on Airmax either way. However, I do find Whiteflame to be scummier. He kind of artfully redirected a pretty strong lynch consensus on him and Awesome to Supa and Awesome. I feel like he just picked the next most scummiest player and pushed hard for it to remove himself from consideration. If WF is scum I'm fairly certain both are town.

I've said multiple times if people want my claim, I'll give it. I think we're shooting ourselves in the foot with so many claims with the anti-claim mechanic in play, particularly if we have anyone we're reading as scum (and I know I do), but if that's what everyone decides they want at this point with all these claims on the table, then I will.

Kind of neither. I am flipping back on supa. I town read his crash out, and whiteflame would have caved to the pressure by now, and is still resistant to claiming. I feel like theres probably a good reason for that. And we have a lot of claims on the board. If I am forced to lynch one of the two I'd almost rather no lynch, but with everyone online I can see us getting a lynch. I don't neccesarily want more claims though. So Idk.

We don't have a no lynch option. The lynch is mandatory.

one thing I will say about whiteflame if he is scum, to look for his partner look for someone he isn't interacting with much. I notice as scum he barely interacts with his scum partner. You guys barely talked to each other in the last game and I feel like I remember that being consistent with games Ive been scum with him in too.

Usually true, yes.

Yeah, I really don't love Vader's claim and, especially given the fake claims scum received, I have a hard time buying it. I'll give this some more thought before I VTL, but that response to being VTL'd isn't helping his case.

Definitely missed this. Are you 100% sure this role cannot be given to town? And are you sure that it is confirmable?

I think you misread a bit. My role can only be given to town. There was one exception I can think of, but the rules of that game were very different.

Because I’d rather die not at fault than die by being at fault

So you changed your mind because you realized being obstinate would be a bigger problem. OK.

Mine isn’t either. The singing portion is but only that. The popular and BP make literally 0 sense with my character

It's not completely off-base for my character in a vague sense, but it's not obvious.

What the hell is day chat? Can they mute people in the DP?

Pretty sure it's in reference to the Discord chats, so the Neighborizer chat and even the scum chat might be mutable.

Because they claimed a role where they actively disable chats, and that would imply what the OP is saying about claiming and such to a certain extent about being weary. At that point I’m going to be forced to claim at this point because we feel it’s going to be better to claim when there’s a literal statement that says to not claim versus holding off claims or even, not lynching. So if I die it’s not my fault and I don’t want to have the burden of getting lynched for not wanting the claim

...none of that answers my question. You said you were vehemently opposed to claiming, willing to be lynched rather than claim. Why did you change your mind and why was two votes enough to do it?

issue Steve as a tracker is a damn good justification.

I mean... it makes sense, I agree, but it also comes off as a pretty safe bet for character claims. And I don't know about you, but my role and character are not that cleanly aligned.

Im not claiming my actual role because of the anti claim utility but I have confirmation utility in the next DP that will confirm my role

Normal mafia I would claim this but with the anti claim mechanic that is strongly advised against doing, I will not be claiming this DP. If I’m lynched well, I don’t really care

Explain this to me. How do you go from posting this to claiming after you have two votes on you?

2) wf claimed he’s affiliation confirmable by role. Don’t really buy this

That is not what I said. I said my role is affiliation-specific, i.e. it is solely a town role. I haven't said anything about confirmation. It's fine if you don't buy it, but at least be accurate to what I've softed.

I can enable or disable day chats. If I die, all day chats are disabled

If mafia chat was the only day chat, my role would be strictly -EV, which is why I talked about masons and neighbors

Alright, now that's interesting. So there is effectively mod confirmation that your role is in this game. That does explain your earlier statement on Masons as well.

Wait I just noticed something that I missed

All factions have day chat. However, there are mechanics that could disable day chat.

Yeah, I pointed this out and it was part of what you scumread me for.

why would he need to clarify that day chat can be disabled. Town has day chat and a mason pm would not be called day chat. Is he clarifying mafia chat can be interrupted or is there a third faction in the game

Could be that several day chats can be influenced. It's unclear.

Yeah, I see the fix.

Oh, got updated. Nevermind, saw the previous post said 4/6 and excluded my name. I'll just:

Unvote

Since I'd rather not invite any hammers until he posts again.

So... huh. Something's up because I have a post with a vote on Awesome, and I'm not registered as "not voting." Let's try shifting this up:

VTL Vader

Seriously, you might want to go back and check on that count. My vote and Unsaid's shift to Awesome in #504 aren't there.