I’m slammed with work this morning, but I promise I will respond to you when I get a chance.
I’m slammed with work this morning, but I promise I will respond to you when I get a chance.
Well... shit. Even night Follower would've been pretty great to have, but here we are. Given how widely townread Banana was, I guess that's not surprising, but it's pretty disheartening.
And at least Vader isn't gone from the game entirely. Good to have you back in, man.
I'm going to bed. It's been a long day and going to be longer tomorrow. I'm going to reconsider a lot of my reads this DP, but if anyone has pertinent information from the NP, now would be a good time to provide it.
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/22/2026 at 1:25 PM (post #350)
Originally Posted by Lunatic on 9/22/2026 at 12:17 PM (post #348)
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/22/2026 at 11:15 AM (post #346)
Originally Posted by Lunatic on 9/22/2026 at 12:10 PM (post #343)
Before we end the phase I really think you should give some sort of soft. You are absolutely the only person besides kiggans who hasn't given any sort of soft, which defeats the purpose of a mass soft. Are you afraid to lock yourself into something?
We shouldn’t have mass softed in the first place. And Kiggans definitely should go first
Why not? You seem pretty pro "getting claims". A soft just locks people in into something they can't back out of without giving away real information.
Claims are solid, softs aren’t, but fine idrc, mine can be good or bad depending on who you ask
Still, gives us something to work with. Interesting.
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/22/2026 at 1:25 PM (post #351)
VTL Vader
Guess we'll see how this shakes out.
Originally Posted by Lunatic on 9/22/2026 at 1:16 PM (post #347)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/22/2026 at 11:11 AM (post #344)
Originally Posted by Lunatic on 9/22/2026 at 1:02 PM (post #329)
We've got an hour left. Is everyone comfortable with where their are votes out? Two similarly sized wagons is interesting, probably a good thing overall, but I want to get some clarification from people about their votes and if this is where they are comfortable staying.
Good timing, I just caught back up.
I think both wagons have decent logic to them and, frankly, neither Vader nor Kohai is that likely to have any form of confirmation, but at least Vader has a role that could theoretically be "confirmed," particularly with the possibility of stopping an NK. I can't say anything from Kohai has swung me on my decision to VTL him, and much as I get his frustration, he should know that he'd be a target this game given he was just scum last game. So the decision not to full claim reads a more scummy to me.
And while I've kind of been giving JenKiggans the benefit of the doubt, their continued absence is making me question it. I don't want to disincentivize them from playing in future games, but I can only take that justification so far.
As far as Jen goes, I think we focus on them dp2 pretty heavily. Don't think we have time to really steer a wagon there, but I agree Jen is 100% a problem based on the activity.
Seems not, would've taken a CFD at this point anyway.
Originally Posted by Lunatic on 9/22/2026 at 1:02 PM (post #329)
We've got an hour left. Is everyone comfortable with where their are votes out? Two similarly sized wagons is interesting, probably a good thing overall, but I want to get some clarification from people about their votes and if this is where they are comfortable staying.
Good timing, I just caught back up.
I think both wagons have decent logic to them and, frankly, neither Vader nor Kohai is that likely to have any form of confirmation, but at least Vader has a role that could theoretically be "confirmed," particularly with the possibility of stopping an NK. I can't say anything from Kohai has swung me on my decision to VTL him, and much as I get his frustration, he should know that he'd be a target this game given he was just scum last game. So the decision not to full claim reads a more scummy to me.
And while I've kind of been giving JenKiggans the benefit of the doubt, their continued absence is making me question it. I don't want to disincentivize them from playing in future games, but I can only take that justification so far.
Originally Posted by Bullish on 9/22/2026 at 11:01 AM (post #282)
Official Vote Count
vader (3/5) - magic, Banana, Thoth,
magic (2/5) - lunatic, vader
Kohai (2/5) - Pie, whiteflame
Pie (1/5) - Kohai,
Not voting: JenKiggans, whiteflame
DP1 ends in ~3 hours, at 09/22 14:00 EST
I'm both voting and not voting? A paradox!
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/22/2026 at 10:52 AM (post #277)
Ya I don’t like the claim from Vader at all. The justification lines up for sure, but 2x Roleblocker could just as easily be the scum role with the Solar Flare as the potential fake character claim.
That's crossed my mind as well. I believe you said it earlier, but we only know that scum received "at most 1 fake role/character claim." So the options they have are likely limited.
Originally Posted by Kohai on 9/22/2026 at 10:37 AM (post #274)
I won’t claim character or justification. I will however claim tree stump (now you know why I was hesitant to claim). Unfortunately y’all can ML me for the upteenth time but y’all are stuck with me the rest of the game
What's the point in holding this information back, exactly? If you're telling the truth, scum won't kill you during the NP, so your only goal at this point should be to prevent the ML. I'm not stuck on you for claiming Tree Stump, but if you expect me to ignore the choice to limit your claim like this when you've already given away your role, you're going to be disappointed.
Originally Posted by Vader on 9/22/2026 at 10:34 AM (post #271)
It’s fine. I had a feeling it was going to be me because I ended up scum reading Magic for the same reasons Luna did in his read unironically as I going through the DP so figured it would. I’m in a role transition that I found out I would be getting last week and need to go through a lot of training. Trying to find time to type
Hopefully it's at least a good transition, though adjusting and training for it is clearly drawing a lot of your focus. Hope it goes well.
I'm willing to place the focus on Kohai for now. I think Vader's claim is at least believable, though the existence of a fake claim for scum leaves the question open. I'll leave it to others to decide if there's more there than I can see.
VTL Kohai
Originally Posted by Vader on 9/22/2026 at 10:27 AM (post #266)
I am a solar flare. My role is a 2x roleblocker. Do with that as you will. Gonna be slammed all day today
The logic was that if a flare was big enough it can fry EMPs causing a blackout
Interesting, so a town RB. A solar flare does fit pretty well, and it is both scientific and kind of boring, so it tracks with what you've said so far. Sorry you're slammed dude.
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/22/2026 at 10:01 AM (post #258)
Originally Posted by Mag1cman on 9/21/2026 at 10:15 PM (post #212)
Still townreading you but I'm really not liking your disappearance when you don't really have to defend yourself.
If town doesn’t want to follow me, then tell me what to do. I’ve said 50 times to get Kohai to full claim, and crickets. We’ve been going in circles all DP, just like I said we would.
At this point, I'm fine with either getting a claim from Kohai or Vader. Much as I don't agree with a lot of Thoth's reads, I do agree that it's best to give JenKiggans some space to post and participate more and I wouldn't support just pressuring or eliminating them.
As for Mag1c vs. Luna, if I had to pick one to pressure, it'd be Mag1c, but he's a secondary priority at the moment. Looking back through his posts, I can at least get some indication of why he changed his read up on you in particular. It's not perfect and I think Luna makes some valid points about his giving himself room to use flips strategically, but I'm ready to say we can just cross that bridge if/when we come to it.
Before reading #224, I had a mild townlean on whiteflame for reasons that I do not want to get into. whiteflame: if my guess is on my point here, it could be worth thinking about how you said your apocalypse is not one that a lot of people prep for. I would like Banana to think about this too, based on her soft in #244. I am not so enthused about your readwall in #224. I don't see JenKiggans citing his being used to IRL Mafia as 'pushback'. I think you should know that Banana can give great readwalls as scum. See Solo Leveling again. Pie has definitely pushed this hard this early many times unless I have Alzheimer's. That observation is so out-of-character for you that it's almost Too Wolfy To Be A Wolf. I absolutely think Mag1c could and would distance and quickly undistance himself from his partner by a country mile if he thought it were the right play. I felt that #168 was scummy, whereas I think you are claiming you see it as townie. I townlean Mag1c, but it's purely a gutread. In other words, I disagree with a lot of your statements and pretty much all of your stated reads.
I appreciate the in-depth explanation, though a lot of this just incorrectly interprets my reads.
To start, my point on Banana wasn't "she has a good readwall so I'm townreading her," it was that I saw her actively pursuing her susses with a lot of questions as well. I'm aware Banana can provide reads that look good in DP1. She's thoroughly capable. However, at least based on my experience with her, I don't think she's likely to go the extra mile and pursue these lines of questioning if she's scum. The fact that she hasn't revisited them much is making me question that, but only a little.
Yes, I would classify JenKiggan's decision to introduce themselves with a post saying that they are used to IRL Mafia and will have trouble reading behavior from posts alone as a bit of "pushback" on trying to provide behavioral reads. If you want to call it something else, be my guest, but it does sound like a bit of an excuse to get out of providing more reads.
I didn't say Pie doesn't push hard early, I said he's "rarely pushed this hard this early," i.e. he's usually not a substantial focus in DP1 for being behaviorally off. That's been my experience, don't know what yours has been.
I'm not convinced that scum Mag1c would draw more attention to himself by distancing and undistancing from his partner, especially since pressure was already coming off of Pie around that time. If the goal was to establish that distance early as a means of separating them, I think he'd keep it up when others are questioning it. You can disagree with that read if you want, but it's my perspective.
And no, I can't say I agree with you that #168 is scummy, and it's gotten less scummy the longer this argument has gone on about Mag1c changing his reads. I just don't buy that scum Luna doubles and triples down on his view that there's something wrong here, especially given how much he's focused on a pattern rather than individual posts. It seems like your reasoning for scumreading that post runs contrary to even your understanding of Luna's usual scum play, so I don't get your perspective.
Anyway, I'm going to leave it there for tonight. No services tomorrow, so I'll be on early and digging into ISOs in the morning.
Alright, I'm finally caught up. I'm not going to give detailed reads because that will require me to do at least some ISO work going through everyone's posts, but I will give basic thoughts about where I see everyone currently. It's subject to change, but then what isn't?
JenKiggans2026 - Null. I hope whatever landed you in the ER is largely resolved. Can't read much into your thoughts from your few posts so far, just not a lot of reads. Stating that he's used to live in-person Mafia as pushback to his providing more insights earlier is rubbing me the wrong way, but could be true, so null for now.
Banana - Lean town. Strong opening set of posts with a serious set of reads and a lot of detailed questions. If it's a ploy, she's gotten really good at it because this looks like solid scumhunting and analysis.
Thoth - Slight town. Largely comes from the same place as many have mentioned with the apparent error in his PM, just doesn't seem like something he'd mention if he's scum. That isn't because I think he wouldn't draw attention to himself (he often does as scum), but because this doesn't match the usual pattern I expect to see from him as scum. I may elaborate later, but this seems more like townie Thoth.
Pie - Slight town/null. More of a vibe check that's leaning towards the former. A lot of NAI behaviors should put me solidly in the latter camp, but his response to pressure is tugging me towards the townread. He's rarely pushed this hard this early, but usually pushes back harder on giving his claim, something I'd expect more from him as scum. Still, that doesn't feel like a strong behavioral cue, so I'm leaving him a bit on the fence.
Kohai - Null. I was kind of sussing him earlier in the DP when he said Pie was targeting him because they were teammates as scum last game, which seemed a little strange, but it's also the kind of paranoia I've seen from Kohai before. The current read on the potential Mag1c/Pie team seems a little unlikely (I don't think Mag1c creates distance with his partner and then drops it that quickly), but I can at least understand his concern about each. I end up landing in the middle after swinging a bit.
Vader - Slight scum. Don't love the FoS On Kiggans and a little wary of him piggy-backing on Luna's reasoning to put a vote on Mag1c without much reasoning. Feels a little opportunistic on both fronts, given Kiggan's relative absence and Mag1c already becoming a major focus.
Luna - Lean town. I've often agreed with his reads, but his thoughts on Mag1c in post #168 swayed me more than usual. I can see how he derived his conclusions from a pattern of behavior and read choices that he sees from Mag1c. I want to dig more into that read and see if I come to the same conclusions independently, but the pushback from Mag1c on each of those changes to his reads hasn't looked great.
Mag1c - Null. I'd like to go through all of his reads and see if I can understand the changes he's made over the course of the DP. Setting that aside for now, I'm a little baffled by the sudden influx of posts just before he thought the DP would end and the vote on Kiggans that accompanied that sudden flurry. Possible he was just frustrated by what looked like a no lynch in progress, or it could just be an effort to get the last word in before the DP closes and look like he's the only one who cares. Haven't decided which.
I promise I'll get into this more this evening, been running around ever since services this morning.
Originally Posted by Thoth on 9/20/2026 at 5:22 PM (post #86)
Re: post #68. I have never heard of anyone actively prepping for my apocalypse in the way that doomers get ready for nuclear war or a pandemic.
Alright. Same’s true of mine.
Originally Posted by Thoth on 9/20/2026 at 8:01 PM (post #87)
Also, upon re-reading my PM, I just realized that it is factually incorrect.
The PM itself? Might want to touch base with Bullish about that.
Originally Posted by Kohai on 9/20/2026 at 4:44 PM (post #84)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/20/2026 at 2:14 PM (post #81)
Originally Posted by Kohai on 9/20/2026 at 12:44 PM (post #76)
Yeah. There's zero chance pie is town here.
Anyway I'm gonna get ready for yom kippur
Is there though? Being a bit aggressive early on isn’t unusual for him regardless of alignment.
True. But he's obviously targeting me because we were scum mates last game
Not really AI from my perspective.
May you have a meaningful and reflective Yom Kippur.
Amen and may you also have a meaningful and reflective Yom Kippur.
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/20/2026 at 12:33 PM (post #72)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/19/2026 at 8:26 PM (post #41)
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/19/2026 at 8:59 PM (post #39)
Vote Kohai plz. Otherwise it’s going to be CFD and town may not get a lynch on scum like last game lol
Dude, I don’t get why you’re pushing this hard for this, especially given the DP extension.
Gotta generate the activity early on. We’ve been sitting on our asses early on. If I have to be the bad guy to do that, that’s fine
Fair, though I can’t say I’ve seen good reason to call out Kohai yet. Might just be that I’m giving him too much of a pass for Yom Kippur-related absences.
Originally Posted by Mag1cman on 9/20/2026 at 10:07 AM (post #68)
Originally Posted by Mag1cman on 9/20/2026 at 9:53 AM (post #67)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/19/2026 at 8:26 PM (post #37)
Well, we have to start somewhere, so let’s do some light soft claiming. If people want to follow me on this, you’re welcome to do so, just thinking we say what medium our apocalypse is from.
Mine is from a book
spaced out and didn’t even type what I was going to type oops
I’d say too many people are afraid of mine. A pair of different ways it could go; I know of at least one couple in my town who actually spend time preparing for it.
Alright, that limits yours pretty cleanly. Does your PM cite specific examples from fiction or is it more generalized? Mine is very specific.
Originally Posted by Lunatic on 9/20/2026 at 9:42 AM (post #65)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/19/2026 at 6:26 PM (post #37)
Well, we have to start somewhere, so let’s do some light soft claiming. If people want to follow me on this, you’re welcome to do so, just thinking we say what medium our apocalypse is from.
Mine is from a book.
Mine's a pretty common fear, though im unsure how realistic it is. Maybe more realistic if you buy into paranoia from recent events.
Hmm, interesting. So just to get a basic idea, your apocalypse is not cited as being from a given source, or is it cited as being from multiple sources as a broadly used type of apocalypse?
Originally Posted by Thoth on 9/19/2026 at 9:28 PM (post #42)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/19/2026 at 10:31 AM (post #10)
I will admit, I wasn’t quite sure what to expect in terms of apocalyptic events, but I think mine gives me some clear grounding on what these encompass. I suspect there’s a range from events that kill a lot of people and/or fundamentally change the world all the way up to the end of humanity. I’m going to be a little vague from there, since I think there are some restrictions that would best remain unsaid.
Fascinating. You know this from your role PM?
I suspect it given my expectations of the game and what I can see from my role PM.
Well, we have to start somewhere, so let’s do some light soft claiming. If people want to follow me on this, you’re welcome to do so, just thinking we say what medium our apocalypse is from.
Mine is from a book.
Originally Posted by Thoth on 9/19/2026 at 6:28 PM (post #30)
Originally Posted by whiteflame on 9/19/2026 at 10:31 AM (post #11)
That’s cryptic. Can’t say I noticed anything off base
Originally Posted by ILikePie5 on 9/19/2026 at 2:47 PM (post #22)
Are you going to elaborate about what’s wrong or are you just being autistic?
My role PM contradicts a statement in the OP.
Alright, interesting.