Helz

I do not even remotely remember that going that way. I remember being rather critical of you afterwards asking you why you did not push against the elimination if you had a green check. I also remember calling you out on that today to which you linked a post and I saw you had all of a couple of posts on the subject.

I was not going to unpack this here but I am very critical of this. You should have been fighting for your confirmed town read. Voicing it hardline how you mech know they are town as I was pushing the town for better reasoning. Not one post squeaking out that you had a peek which ended up being wrong.

I can say for my reactions I have not given much thought or attention to discord chat. I have been shitposting on my phone most of the time and not even bothering to track information. But I believe I would strongly remember a hard alignment cop claim and check on the player who was getting killed. I am still rather critical of this situation

So what I did there was bait them leveraging the result of their interactions and flip as damaging to their team. Then I did an ego up play as I voiced they should give me reads. They kept going along because they had a social driver to correct a past harm and felt only by interacting could they do so which is an interrogation thing. But thats kinda the short of it.

Honestly I was just drunk and saw something so absurd I could not stomach it. Then I felt I could get them to implicate their team pushing for more info. I was pushing to them that they screwed a team mate (which ended up being the case as I was baiting for some info there) as I tried to make them paranoid about their spew and I then pressured them for information in twilight as long as I could.

But yeah. Was not the best move on my part. I was not trying to grab town cred and I fucked myself with day timing given that a day and a half of D2 I pretty much missed because of the court thing.

This is why I am so apathetic. None of you seem to give a shit and just want 1 thing I will not give you. Nothing I can do with that. There is nothing to defend against or arguments to address so kill me or don't. Orrrrrr maybe actually grill me and push me for info and vet what I have done and why and lets actually play a game of lies, deception, and analysis. Just a thought.

Well 2 things.

1 actually using analysis. Reading me as scum and arguing how what I have done is scummy then challenging me on it to understand my motives.

2 actually having a reason for a mech kill. It would be one thing if I was seen visiting a player who was killed and am now suspected of being the killer as you demand a role claim but this is just a vague demand for it and lack of a total claim = death. For what?

Im hearing people behaviorally read me as town. Cool. Also if you guys think I am scum put me through the wringer and milk every bit of info you can from me before I flip. Thats not what is happening. Its just this lethargic "Oh he is not doing the thing we expect and is a social norm so lets kill him even if there is no AI reason for it in this situation"

I mean fuck. At least I could feel better about this if there was one single town member grilling me for info so post flip if I was mafia they would have shit to work off or when I flip town they could also work with that knowing my views came from a confirmed town.

There’s a reason there are only like 10 pages usually in our 9p games. Not everyone engages. It’s impossible to get people to engage. Your idea is right in the sense that people should say as much shit as possible and ask questions, but people don’t no matter how many times you tell them. Shining is the prime example.

I read your guide. There’s good stuff in there, but the problem with it is that humans themselves don’t follow logic. Kohai is a prime example of that. All your theory works if there’s logic in the game. But there’s only a few people with the level of logic and brainpower and town to actually play the game.

Yeah, expecting people to behave logically is an entire thing. But I hope you got something from my scribblings there. It has been fun playing with you. Sorry if I was a dickhead earlier.

I can jump in but it will be a bit.

Im totally good with whatever happens here. Feel pretty betrayed about how my guild went about what they did and not really gona struggle to hang around in this game. Trust me or don't. Vet me with questions if you have them. But if your just gona act like robots and say "Dude did not do the thing we are socially conditioned to do so we must kill him" be on with it.

You are correct. I am putting as much effort into my defense as I see being put into a case against me.

Well, actually I think I put a lot more effort in unpacking what I did and why..

What I just told the guild as well is that I will flip town but go after shining afterwards. This was a stupid elimination but I do not even have much to argue against or anyone vetting me so just get on with it. In future games you will know that a refusal to claim a part of a role does not equate to any sort of guilt.

And really hopefully the town starts to scratch their head and say "Wait, why do we demand role claims to begin with...." You guys fucked this all the way up.

Then follow the steps of your fellow scum and vote yourself. Save us some time

No. I have not ever payed against my win condition and I will not. You guys want to do a stupid its on you.

So I am gona unpack what I said in my guild chat.

There was this study once upon a time where they took a group of monkeys and put them in a room. There was a button they could push and they would get a banana. But if they hit it the other monkeys would get sprayed with a water hose.

After so long the monkeys would attack etch other if they tried to push the button. They did not like what happened to them.

One by one the monkeys got replaced. Each monkey put in the cage was taught by the others that they just do not go near that button. They accepted it as a social norm. At some point none of the original monkeys were in the cage. Not a single one had ever gotten a banana or been sprayed with a hose. But they just knew you do not touch the button.

That is this elimination. Without knowing why I am going to be killed because I do not full claim. Without questioning if there is a town or scum motive or how that would solve the game in any way its what we are going to do. Your meta social conditioning is a joke and I just shrug and say "Do it then" and your gona act like its my fault when I flip town. But you are the conditioned monkeys not thinking things through in this situation.

Go ahead and do it. I am not going to play less optimal just because you have a rehearsed norm of demanding a full claim.

And I told you multiple times I am 100% good with being eliminated and will not give you a claim. And that even having a full claim does nothing to prove my alignment.

Im just gona laugh thinking about how Shining's 1 shot lighting rod that requires recruitment got by as this happened. Its honestly just funny.

Rex never did come on and talk to me in guild chat btw.

They posted the same thing they Xposted here and dipped out. Not a single bit of interaction. If my guild had a scum its them. Although honestly I think both are town and just derped.

Like really, In what world do you say "Dude is scum" and have no interest in their reads and shit. Lol. Could not even make this up

Okay I am starting to lose it here buddy. How many times do I have to explain why you're under pressure here. I told the guild chat who I was investigating to see if my result would be manipulated. My result was manipulated. That implicates someone in our guild. Rex has full claimed. You refuse to. How many times. How many times.

You have exactly two results which are both confirmed false. I am not sure why but kinda dont care. This entire thing that I need to claim the other half of my abilities as if its even slightly AI is just dumb.

Just get Shining after I flip. My apathy could not be greater than it already is. Gave everyone an opportunity to vet me and milk me for info and nobody even wanted to try. I am putting as much effort into my defense as I see the town putting into hunting. Feel free to hammer

Look uhh, I am totally cool with being the lynch if thats where we are going with this.

I do not even really see a case against me. I looked like 3p while people can confirm I actively encouraged that and tried to make myself look scummy? I claimed what I will claim so feel free to hammer me if thats where this is going. Your reasoning is bad and post flip if you bother to think about it your gona ask yourself why you did such a bad elimination but I am 100% fine with getting out of this game.

There is this whole thing I do looking at what information has value to be given where.

And when I ask for information I am mindful of what information I ask for and why I am asking for it.

You guys just have some default "Full claim or die" thing but your turning the brain cells off asking why you are even doing that. If I have 2 people that can confirm I was role blocked for most of the game and took exactly 1 action and I confirm what that action was demanding the rest is just you wanting info. Nothing actually AI in the current situation. Do what you want with that.

Except there literally is.

For post flip if nobody is interested in grabbing takes from me Shining's claim sounds like some bullshit to me. I will leave it at that.

Well, Im never gona full claim. Do what you must.

And acknowledge that whatever I claim only gives you value later in the game and does nothing to sort the current situation. Even if you are kinda use to just going through these motions.

He’s probably making shit up lol. Why would anyone give him shit vs giving it to the guild leaders

Its my role. I ask daddy for things and he gives them to me. They do things. One of the two is a tracker function.

@ILikePie5

I feel I owe you an apology. I may be frustrated with the game but it was not cool for me to say what I did. I do view you as a strong player and I should not have said that to you. I can only say that I am sorry and vented on you. Regardless of what happens I was out of line there. I was wrong for saying that to you.

What did REF hide?

I do not think they hid anything. They claimed a miller function and an action.

They have been silent in guild chat sense starting this shit show but I do not think they have any secret and such.

Orrrr you have actively hindered it by refusing to just sort yourself and then making demands that are not even AI.

Your use to doing this robotic thing where you demand a claim. Ok. Great... Exactly how does it help you sort my alignment to know that I can track people? What possible piece of information right now is useful about that?

Pretty sure I voiced that in this chat but yes- that is what I referred to as a miller function.

I will not move on my position of a full claim.

I will openly offer people can ask me anything so post flip they have something to work with if they want anything thats in my brain.

Nothing you said makes me feel better besides maybe the fact that REF is hiding something. Full claim or be lynched. Idrc

Then lynch me you dunce. People kept acting like your some super strong player and I just do not see it. I see a power tripping mid level player with little understanding of how the game works. You can not get over your own hubris far enough to lead the town.

I bet Shining is laughing their ass off watching this interaction.

To be fair Wryly was a bit upset when I was so ok with being lynched. Lol.

Pretty towny reaction from them to be sure. Rex has yet to show their face sense kicking all this bullshit off. Pinged them and offered to explain anything they wanted but they are MIA in our guild chat.

Wryly wants me to clarify my tracking deal. So for my night actions-

n1 recrutment

n2 I asked daddy for a pair of goggles that on N3 I could track a player. Something of an odd day function sort of thing. I duno who my daddy is in the anime but apparently he can give me things : )

Well I have played a few thousand games. I do not think there is much I am not use to.

I have claimed the thing that matters and explained exactly what I was doing and why.