This was the defense I said I recalled. Yes, everyone is town, except the recruit. But #436, when you call Mikal "probably town," you're treating him like he couldn't be the recruit. It's TMI.
I mean if you really want to pick apart that with semantics, you could spin it however you want. I am not willing to account for the recruit target over hunting for the known scum member. I explained why I town read mikal for his claim accuracy to the role, plus how the role doesn't make sense being on the scum team. He could only be a recruit if scum, was my point.
And I don't find this to be a towny approach. Again, townies know that they could die. So townies are going to do what analysis they can before going out. Not just for the whole Pie+Kohai thing, but also for what happens after Pie is lynched. You not wanting to look into the recruits is exactly my point. You were convinced Pie was scum, you knew he was the lynch, and yet instead of moving on and working on the next steps for town, you sat on your laurels.
All this talk about me not finding the recruit, but you waffled about making a decision for 2 days into LYLO about the recruit. You can't act like you weren't pretending to be phased by the Yakuza lynch then all of a sudden act holier than thou about others not being able or willing to solve it immediately. My focus was pie, who I was pretty damn confident was scum. It's not in my hands to solve the whole game by dp2, and if I died as a vanilla town got 100% value from my role.
I wasn't fully buying into his role, but yes, I was noting there was a real chance he could've been town. His claimed role had matched some of his DP1 behavior. And yes, he was the obvious target for framing.
But that's only a possibility. He also had really scummy behavior around Kohai, and seemingly (in hindsight, clearly) pasted part of a post of his from scum chat. I had resolved to hammer him if someone else didn't do it. I just decided to use the rest of time in the DP to get my thoughts out before hammering.
I mean at that point you probably thought pie wasn't worth saving anymore. You probably initially wanted to vote with him thinking there was a real shot at getting a mislynch that you could explain your way out of, but when you saw the crowd wasn't leaning that way, pussied out.
This is pedantic. We can argue about what counts as alphaing up, but the point is that you engage people directly. I only brought up last game to add to my point; it's not the point itself.
But I just proved that your example of last game isn't the same thing as what you are attempting to accuse me of now, showing it's a completely convoluted point.
You can only switch away from Pie if the rest of town does. Otherwise, town calls you out for switching up.
I'm not saying you're scummy for pushing Pie, I'm saying I'm not giving you town credit for it. The thing I'm calling you scummy for is not doing much to explore who the recruit could be.
You didn't know who the recruit was either until literally yesterday, so what did "exploring" do? If anything exploring the recruit seems more like setting up mislynches. Like you did with mikal lol
This is the one thing you gave yes. But it's not much at all. It's just random shade at Magoroth. At a time when Pie could've easily been fake distacing with Magoroth. You didn't explore anyone else or give thoughts on anyone else until DP3. But DP2 was the towny time to do it.
Because you say it is? Hard dis-agree. Im not divulging in WIFOM that could distract from a scum lynch when there is plenty of time to do that in further day phases. If I die, that's in the rest of towns hands. Town aren't expected to try and solve the whole game days in advance in the off chance they die, in fact they rarely do.
Yes I agreed with you on that specific point, but you drawing so much attention to it to me specifically reads like buddying.
I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything, because I genuinely did not understand how he was town confirmed off of that, and maybe you picked up on something with it I didn't. Hardly buddying.
To an extent, this is valid. But then if it's a bad move, then he could do it. FMPOV, it's 50/50 whether he went for Magoroth or you, two options that I wouldn't have considered. So the WIFOM above the WIFOM is less about who doesn't seem like a good option, but more about which of the two bad options, chosen to throw town off, is more likely to carry the rest of the game. And that's you.
I mean the whole thing is complete wifom, its just the wifom you choose to believe, because it supports your narrative. I hard disagree that I am the best recruit target in this scenario. Also me and pie have very different mafia playstyles. You on the other hand work way better with him than I do, and are probably one of the best scum players on the site. I can see scum pie recruiting you all day.
Sure, but if Pie can get the rest of town to townread him, you can easily stop sussing Pie as well. It was a desperate situation for Pie.
I mean by that logic, he kind of did get close to lynching mago, a couple people mentioned supporting him. I stayed true to lynching him that whole time. You didn't. You are accidentally making the case for yourself being scum here.
Two people can have the same argument. Are you going to deny that I've had plenty of my own argments?
This is a read on Pie as much as it is on you btw. Distancing is the level one WIFOM play. Fake distancing someone is the level two play. Pie is doing everything he can to throw town off; he's not going to go for level one, he's going to go for whatever thinks is the exact level above what town is thinking. Wheh it comes to such hard distancing, it's proven that town doesn't usually think into the second level.
Pie was the heaviest suspect at the end of day one, and the pressure picked RIGHT back up at start of dp2. It got worse when thoth revealed he was guilty. If you have a guilty on you, and your only argument was "I was framed" you know you are cooked. Getting a mislynch off on literally anyone before you die is the ONLY play pie can make.
My point is that what I think happened is that you were hoping Magoroth would tunnel me. And if that fails, you buddy up to me, which is why you went out of your way to point out MAgoroth's self clear attempt to me. And if that doesn't work, then it's a good old-fashioned Mexican standoff, where you can try to use you being on Pie all game for town cred (even if it's not a towny as you assert- you obviously can use try and use it to convince MAgoroth)
I think you were doing the exact same thing for most of the day phase. Difference was I genuinely town read both of you, and made a giant mega post explaining possibilities of you guys being both town and motives you could have had for being scum. You just waffled and claimed to be willing to do a random vote, before randomly coming up with a mega case on me. This was actually YOUR strategy, but you caved to the pressure and were worried after mago mentioned lynching you, so knew your options were limited.
Well, kinda yeah. You didn't really push or pressure or press or investigate anyone but Pie last DP. Yes there was the shot at Magoroth for potential distancing, but the exception was so rare it proves the pattern.
I had found both scum off of behavior already. I townread everyone else. Even you admittedly. You played an amazing scum game.
