Helz

Originally Posted by Mag1cman on 10/7/2026 at 9:51 PM (post #285)

done. I may or may not have been playing Among Us while isoing

VTL Helz

Solid scum. At minimum, I want a claim here. A few things:

1. He's made multiple posts talking about/apologizing for not being his usual self... honestly feels more like an excuse for any meta read someone might have on him.
2. The N0 cop idea, especially his stated reason, doesn't make sense. Let's say the cop does answer the question and tells us all who they would've checked N0... that is not a confirmation of who the cop would target NP1, as there is a whole NP for circumstances to change. I think it's more likely to be a tool for scum to plan around than an actual cop crumb opportunity. If someone susses who they said they would check throughout the DP, mafia can plan around that. It's limited, but it can help mafia scout for any cop check coming their way, more than it helps town decipher who a dead cop visited. And even if town is able to figure that out, it doesn't tell us the result, because the cop would be dead. Even if not part of a scum plan to scout for anything, it still feels like a fake contribution off its uselssness.
3. Asking Magoroth for his character is genuinely so weird.

I will respond point by point

1- I never and I do mean never use real life issues to excuse myself for mafia. There is 2 reasons for this. When I first started playing I used emotional manipulation for advantage and I concluded it was just disgusting. Sure I can stir someone up and piss them off to get a valid read but it ruins their experience.

The other less moral reason is that if I have real life things going on and say so I do not want it questioned in the game. If I have to work I say so. If I feel sick and not up to it I say so. The second I start using that for in game advantage that goes away. I wont dump my purse here but yes- I am in a bad head space and I am openly saying it. This is something I never lie about honestly I do not respect as a play when others do it. If you gotta pull that kinda stuff to win in a game its just ugly.

2- N0 cop claims is very standard practice globally within the mafia community. It works very well and is frustrating for scum. I get that your new to the idea but there is a reason its such an accepted play. I would challenge you to find a single standard mafia championship game with a confirmed cop where it was not used. There is a reason for that- it actually works for town and hurts scum.

3- So ehhh. Brah.. Whats your character name? Lets make this weird with extra levels of eye contact ; )

My vote is actually not on them. It was at the games start but then I voted then unvoted Kohai to prove the popular claim. I should be on nobody right now.

I would be fine with it. I really am afraid of dealing with Shining late game. Only reason I caught them that one game was that I worked through every other slot and by PoE determined they must be scum in every single situation I could see being reasonable.

It does have the problem of being low benefit with little information given from their flip either way but its a question of 'is there any other way we can deal with sorting them' in a game where town has X time to solve or it just looses.

I would say thats healthy. I am curious where I was trying to gatekeep. If anything I have been pretty hands off this game and only really voiced some soft strategy and grabbed a few tells here and there. I expect my play this game will be outside of anything I have done in years for either alignment if I can not get myself to push.

Yeah, I get the same way at times. Sometimes whatever magic my mind works is just not there and reading people is slog.

I am around if you would like me to ask anything. Kinda struggling to engage. Started and stopped making a read wall a few times.

For timing the game I think we should work around our early lynches. A hit means we have more chances.

I also think we should reserve the idea to speed run a few days later on if required. Could just pick out the 2 most likely town players and run through the rest of them in the right situation.

But by default 7 Town 2 Mafia

Worst case-

N1- 1 Misslynch 1 killed

D2 5 town 2 mafia

N2- 1 Misslynch 1 killed

D3 Lylo at 3 town 2 Mafia

Game could even end with a potential of a town killing function existing.

Without unpacking a bunch of potentials of a successful town kill or prevented scum kill lynching a Mafia D1 translates to the normal situation of us having a D4 Lylo with 2 Town 1 Mafia.

Only real way we go past D4 is with prevented kills and such. A Vet / Paranoid gun owner could also add a day given it both prevents a kill as well as removes the scum.

Regardless looking at our RNJesus odds we are running at a 22% first elimination chance and a 25% Alignment cop check chance with tracker / detective / lookout etc running about the same odds but having the disadvantage of false positives (assuming first lynch is bad)

Could be slightly townsided game but also we need to keep control of having people submit actions. Would suck for critical actions to go unused because someone forgot to submit.

Anyways.. Done rambling and I think I have my head around my thoughts of the timeline for the game now.

Magic I slightly town read. I slightly see their lack of knowledge of who is in the game to suggest they are either playing with an inactive player or they are not scum. Potential town slip in a way there. (Different from me, my action was from a thing with the host.) I would expect the mafia chat has had at least some conversation at this point about flavor as well as who is in the game. Or simply copied the claim tracking that Kohai is doing.

The flavor thing I am not super focused on. I wanted content to help break RVS and it seems to have pushed the game along a little bit. That and Noah's reaction it seems everyone agrees with my thinking on which is worth something.

I will say I am not super concerned with it revealing actions. My action you gotta do some real mental gymnastics to conclude its connection to my flavor. Its also interesting that the people hesitant or against the mass claim are also not concerned with an anti-claim mechanic although my paranoia there may not be fitting for this sites meta. I am just more use to it being in play to counter the issue caused by having AI flavor.

Peek claims I would like to keep up through the day cycles. Its just useful and removes an alignment cops requirement to seed their actions which I usually pick up pretty easily as a wolf. Something at zero cost to the town that will give us some benefit.

The player list was from Andor according to the host. If I were to step back from me being one of the two mentioned I would say it makes them more likely not aligned unless the game had a need to flag like having a lost wolf in play and such. This one has a hard set number of mafia at 2 with no neutrals.

Something I will be watching is how far Noah takes the new player thing. That question asking what hammering was paired with how frequently they ask for direction could be a not so new player laying it on a bit too thick. I did loose one time to a player doing exactly that as I was given nothing to read them on and they just sheeped through an entire game. Time will tell but I wanted to poke at it. I sometimes have trouble reading super new players.

Im not opposed to doing a policy. This game in particular with a hard timeline town will just loose we can not afford to have that in the late game.

Lunatic

Mag1cman

Shinging

Thoth

Looks like we will be waiting to get the game really rolling until we get some engagement from these slots.

WhiteFlames response to the flavor claims was interesting. I specifically noted that while they wanted to withhold their claim they also did not discourage the concept itself. Their take on NoClark largely echoed my own take and their take on testing Kohai felt NAI. Its useful for scum to know their elimination thresholds but I do not really see testing it as a positive for either side unless they had concerns about a Jester or some vengeful function existing and wanted to bait a townie into the situation. Thats a bit too tinfoil hat for me to really get behind as a potential though.

The host accidently posted the wrong player list into the thread. They fixed it but yeah, that happened.

Standard D1 strategy of insulating potential alignment cops N0 peek.

Essentially if every player posts a peek then if an alignment cop is killed we do not have to guess who they checked. If I am the alignment cop I am then insulated while town is given direct claims post flip. If I am not then any other alignment cop would be protected and able to out claims without fear.

Should sort that well enough..

VLT: Unvote

VTL Kohai

Ok, It is currently 4:59 my time. At 5:20 I will post the vote.

Easy mode we just set a time for the vote to drop. Gives others time to recognize its gona happen and kills excuses for the most part of an accidental hammer.

If you would really like me to I will do it. I just simply believe you given it would be an absurd thing to lie about unless you were a Jester grabbing the easy quick win.

I very much doubt a Jester fits in this setup though and if you were some kinda vengeful you would be targeting someone specific to hammer.

They claimed a "Popular" role modifier. This means for them to be eliminated they will require 1 extra vote. This can be proven by voting them to verify they do not get eliminated.

I personally just didn't care. I could see either Town or Wolves having such a modifier and I simply believe their claim given how easily it can be verified. So I accepted it as truth and moved on.

I haven't really thought about it much. At some point I will do my usual thing and look at how many eliminations town can afford and how much time we have, but motivation is lacking at the moment.

What are your thoughts on the subject?

From memory this site usually gets active 2-4 hours from now.

I am apathetic as to setting some hard timer for day phases. Its a dynamic I have not delt with before but I could see value in running things out naturally depending on participation unless things start to really drag out. And even then I feel that will itself be an indicator we can use to hunt with as Mafia will have motive to drag their feet looking at next Tuesday as the guaranteed win.

Same thing with a different name. I think Mag is trying to put a peg on your experience level to get a vibe of how to read you. Someone who has played only a game or two has to be treated very differently than someone who has played thousands.

Im generally against early role claims. Revealing a protective or a Vigilante could be damaging for the town placing them in a position to lie the same as a Scum would.

Unless there is anti-claim function the flavor is a decent focus though. I dislike it as a mechanic but I will probably lack my usual aggression this game.

Interesting. Also interesting that he has not popped into chat if he has submitted N0 actions.

Any details on what that would do? It could also open doors for a cult to exist although I was told the game is not bastard and many consider alignment changing mechanics as bastard.

The entire idea is to get the game going.

People randomly vote and shift them around until real reasoning is created behind the votes. Me voting someone with a joke statement can lead to others voting them or me and patterns start to form. Then people start seeing things they feel could be a motive for a scum and such and real issues come up.

Im a big fan of also using mech to break RVS which is why I lead off leaning into the flavor thing.

As town you want the game to get away from 'nobody has any thoughts about anyone' so real analysis and 'trains' (or pushes to lynch/eliminate someone) can form.

Scum has the advantage early on and this helps remove that advantage. Its typically a good play to end up with 2 trains at the end of every day so they can be compared later as we look back and have 'flips' or reveals of someones alignment by the host after they die.

Mine kinda does. I guess I was accused in the scandal as a powerful person that was around it. Being a General followed by leading the country for a bit was mentioned.

What is the name of your flavor if I may ask?

So far my only read so far is very soft town lean on NoAhLeEcLaRk. Rex is lock town.

I liked that they dropped their flavor right off the bat. There is a question of if they even considered if it could be AI or not although I would have expected that to be an immediate subject of conversation in a wolf chat.

I also got good feels from them flatly voicing they were sheeping. They had a door open to take a tiny bit of town cred and shoved it away which reads as flat transparency to me. WIFOM could be argued but given its their very first game and may not have even understood what I was poking at but I am more inclined to just feel good about that stance.