You even as a non practicing Christian should know you cannot cherry pick parts of the Bible that appeals to you.

Such as?

It is possible you have lost your faith and Satan has you under his control, forcing you to corrupt the teaching in the Bible.

Nope> my arguments come from the bible itself. You just don't like it when someone like me highlights these contradictory, flawed, ambiguous half stories that the BIBLE throws out far too often.

you even refuse to accept the first commandment “you shall have no other gods before me”.

I accept that it is written in the bible, but the same GOD of bible speaks of other gods and recognises them to the point that he commands HIS OWN chosen tribe not to "revile the gods and kings of other nations". And that is something that you continuously refuse to accept, even when your god recognises there to be other gods.

This shows the degree of your regression and Satan’s control over you.

That's not good enough. and it it won't win you an argument.

This only goes to prove the grip Satan had on the Jewish people.

It proves nothing of the sort. You have admitted yourself that Pilate crucified Jesus do sedition.

They were so blinded by Satan that they could not recognize Jesus’s mission and even chose Barabbas over Jesus.

More nonsense: Even his close inner circle of 12 didn't know or have a clues as to what Jesus' actual mission was.

But Jesus’s sacrifice and death were prophesied and served to fulfill his mission.

So you say. But its odd then that god forgot to tell Jesus' Mother Mary ( blessed among all women) about her sons cruel torturous demise, isn't it? After telling about all the great things that her son will achieve and what he will become?

The Jews have been punished by God throughout their history.

So the bible says; But it is odd don't you think that these punishments" came in the form of natural disasters and or defeat in battles and war all fought by men? I shall expand on this later.

Interesting Post, Goy.

Tell me, why would Pilate allow (Jesus Barabbas) a murderer of Romans and frequent rebellions to go free and instead brutally crucify a ( believed to be) peace loving pacifist that preaches "turn the other cheek and give to the poor"?

And why did the multitude cry out for and demand the death of Jesus after all the "wonderful miracles" he is said to have performed that was purported to have been witnessed buy thousands?

This is what is fascinating and confusing about the future politics from then as quite clearly it is the far left who loathe religion.

religion was the politics of the time.

After all of the witnessing of “miracles & wonders” by hundreds of thousands of Jewish people and hundreds of thousands more hearing those wonderful sermons about selling your worldly goods to give “poor” and buy swords, it appears that the short minded and forgetful Jews still couldn’t recognise a “messiah” when they seen and heard one in action. Or could they?

The crowds, we are told were so desperate to watch this man Jesus work his miracles and wonders that they would climb trees to get just a glimpse of him or cut holes in the roof of the house just to get a better view and be nearer to him. Mark3:20 – Mark4:1 – Luke 7:11 – Luke 8:19 Luke 12:1. Thousands upon thousands had also travelled long distances too:

 “many people came to him from Judea, Jerusalem, Idumea, and the regions across the Jordan and around Tyre and Sidon”. Mark 3:7-9

And it is said that just a glimpse of Jesus was enough to have the Jews“overwhelmed with wonder” and clamouring to greet him”. Mark9:14

So to say he was `held in high esteem` doesn't even cover it does it.

How then could it all suddenly be forgotten by thousands of people that had witnessed Jesus healing the sick and making dead people alive again on so many occasions? What about all those wedding guests that he had kept in booze all day, John2:1-11, had even they too forgot this “miracle”?

Where were the five thousand and the four thousand that had heard the sermons spoken by the “son of god” himself and who had fed every single one of them? Matthew 14:13-21, Matthew 15:29-39.

Pilate asked them, "Which one do you want me to release to you: Jesus Barabbas, or Jesus who is called the Messiah?" Matthew27:17;

“Barabbas,”they answered. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!? 

Luke23:25 offers a little more information by telling us that:

“He released the man [Barabbas] who had been thrown into prison for insurrection and murder, but he delivered Jesus over to their will”.

So these ungrateful Jews- those he had actaully been sent so save - it appears, preferred it that a murder was let loose amongst them to run the streets. 

Why then did the multitude of Jews choose the murdering zealot Jesus Barabbas over the son of god and prince of peace Jesus the Messiah?Jesus after all, was the messiah allegedly prophesied about in the OT and recognise to be the messiah by non other than John the Baptist about whom the bible says was: “the greatest prophet that was ever born of woman” Matthew11:

Was it a case of Right or Wrong Choice? Or just another made up story ?

Oh and lets us not forget, some of those people may have been Christians too, when we consider that a few members here on this forum insist that there were Christians in Jesus' time.

Read your post above. You talk about God’s gift as[.....]

that would be the sarcasm I mentioned

well as your journey as a non practicing Christian in your profile.

My profile mentions nothing of a "journey", only my opinion on Christians and the scriptures.

And here it is>>

I have nothing against Christians. But they should be prepared to defend their beliefs when the bible is put under scrutiny, without playing victim and throwing accusations around such as "bullying, victimisation and all the other shite they come out with when stuck on the backfoot after painting themselves into a corner. And "CONTEXT"!!! & "cherry picking are the most used excuses when well and truly painted in said corner.

I simply do not accept the bible (New Testament in particular) in the way it has come down to us nor how it has been preached to us over the millennia. I have no problem believing that a man called Jesus existed minus the so called "miracles".

https://www.debatecraft.com/users/Stephen

God revealed to Moses about the future included how his mission would end. It is possible Moses shared it with others like Joshua who came after him to complete Deuteronomy.

I'm sure that it would have been mentioned had this been the case. But there is absolutely no evidence that proves your conjecture. This is exactly what I mean when I say that the bible is full of ambiguous half told stories.

Why cant' you just admit that it was a much later addition and was written by a completely different author?

Gods here can be translated as god, angel or judge. It’s been used to refer to Israelite judges.

eg haven’t ye heard it said , ye are gods. (Elohim). That was referencing the congregation of judges.

You do realise don't you( maybe not) that every time that you post a reply on this thread that you prove my point and debunk your own?

Gods here can be translated as god, angel or judge. It’s been used to refer to Israelite judges.

eg haven’t ye heard it said , ye are gods. (Elohim). That was referencing the congregation of judges.

You do realise don't you( maybe not) that every time that you post a reply on this thread that you prove my point and debunk your own?

You admit even the single celled brain given as a gift from the Lord is worth more than a lifetime practicing non Christian like you.

And you don't understand sarcasm. And I admitted no such thing.

Off you go now,

You are supposed to be explaining how Moses was able to write about his own death and burial.

Why can you not simply admit that he couldn't have and that it was all a later addition.

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--> @Debby

.God is warning he will not tolerate the worship of other gods.

There you are. Wasn't hard was it? God and YOU admitting that that there are/were other gods.

That there is only one true God.

Well you and god contradict yourselves then don't you?

Your god even goes to the extent to order his own "chosen from among all nations" not to revile other gods, but you wouldn't know this because you are thick as mince when it comes to a book that you haven't studied for yourself.

Exodus 22:28

King James Version

28 Thou shalt not revile the gods, nor curse the ruler of thy people.

Bible Dictionary - Revile.

In the Bible, to "revile" means to verbally abuse, insult, or slander someone with contemptuous, hateful language aimed at destroying their character or reputation. It represents a serious sin of the tongue—such as railing, mocking, or cruel taunting—often linked in Scripture to wickedness and pride. 

.God is warning he will not tolerate the worship of other gods.

There you are. Wasn't hard was it? God and YOU admitting that that there are/were other gods.

That there is only one true God.

Well you and god contradict yourselves then don't you?

Your god even goes to the extent to order his own "chosen from among all nations" not to revile other gods, but you wouldn't know this because you are thick as mince when it comes to a book that you haven't studied for yourself.

Exodus 22:28

King James Version

28 Thou shalt not revile the gods, nor curse the ruler of thy people.

Bible Dictionary - Revile.

In the Bible, to "revile" means to verbally abuse, insult, or slander someone with contemptuous, hateful language aimed at destroying their character or reputation. It represents a serious sin of the tongue—such as railing, mocking, or cruel taunting—often linked in Scripture to wickedness and pride. 

The Lord did not want His people to give their hearts, souls and minds to anything ahead of Him.

Yes we know. I agree because he was a "jealous god".

He warned them that wealth, friends and those they married could distract them from focusing on him.

Deuteronomy 7:3-6; 8:11-14; 13:6.

This still doesn't alter the stone cold biblical fact that their existed other gods as your BIBLE AND YOUR GOD ( and Fauxlaw) clearly states and admits.

n this case it is a fulfillment of a promise. His sacrifice as necessary to provide a final, once -for-all atonement for human sin, fulfilling the Old Testament sacrifice system.

Yet another big FAIL.

It still doesn't answer why though does it? Have you ever taken the time to think about it? God being the super duper all singing all dancing god that you believe he is could have just as well said - "all the this sins committed by mankind are forgiven" and with a wave of his mighty majestic hand it would have been done, no need for anyone to be beaten nearly to death, no need for anyone to be nailed to a cross and no need for a single drop of blood to be shed... at all!

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Comments: 167

"Debby" wrote: Moses wrote everything that was revealed to him by God. Moses wrote the first 5 books in the Old Testament. Read it an become a believer.

Stephen wrote: He couldn't' have written Deuteronomy 34:5-7 you absolute clown.

"Debby" wrote: The text indicates that God or some angel buried Moses.with the precise location kept hidden to prevent idolatry..

Does it? Lets see it then.

You have ignored the question. AGAIN!

Here>> what has he -God- to be jealous of if no other gods exist?

Comments: 3399

--> @Stephen

In Exodus 20:5 and 34:14 God identifies himself as a jealous God specifically in the context of the 10 Commandments, demanding exclusive worship and forbidding idolatry.This jealousy is not based on selfish, human security, but rather a “righteous jealousy” or “protective love” that desires the best for humanity, guarding the covenant relationship.

You missed the question AGAIN!!!

Here>> what has he -God- to be jealous of if no other gods exist?

Anyone following our exchanges can easily tell my biblical scholarship puts yours to shame.

I didn't know that one was awarded a "scholarship" for attending Sunday school for under five's.. Well done. Now buy a candle and thank the lord for the gift of that single celled brain that he gave you..

Why haven't you even attempted to address Fauxlaw's op? He believes that there are /were other gods.

AND if the bible is to be believed at all, I happen to agree with him for the biblical reasons that I have shown here on my own thread.

HERE>> https://www.debatecraft.com/forum/c/religion/posts/nw/one-god-it-is-simply-not-true.

And maybe through lack of imagination, fauxlaw as simply made the same claim as I .

Jesus viewed his sacrifice as necessary to provide a final , once-for-all atonement for human sin, fulfilling the Old Testament sacrifice system. As the sinless “Lamb of God” his death substituted for humanity, satisfying divine Justice, and overcoming the penalty of death. This act was designed to redeem mankind, reconcile them with God, and to offer eternal life.

Opinion counts for nothing.

Moses wrote everything that was revealed to him by God. Moses wrote the first 5 books in the Old Testament. Read it an become a believer.

He couldn't' have wrote Deuteronomy 34:5-7 you absolute clown.

You have ignored the question. AGAIN!

Here>> what has he -God- to be jealous of if no other gods exist?

Stephen wrote:And besides, Jesus was forgiving sins well before he was crucified. proving he didn't at all have to dies such a cruel torturous death. And John the Baptist was "washing away the sins of the world " before Jesus came on the scene. So once again again proving that Jesus didn't have to die for our sins.

"Debby" wrote:Jesus could not forgive those that came after him. There had to be a once for all solution. His sacrifice is recognized as a complete eternal payment that covers all sins, past, present and future- allowing for ultimate reconciliation with God.

Stephen wrote:once again you show that you know just about nothing about the life and tie of the Christ and even less about the bible.

Off you go now "Debby"

Those verses cover why Jesus was sacrificed to bring salvation to the world. Read it. It may answer your questions.

Nope.

And besides, Jesus was forgiving sins well before he was crucified. proving he didn't at all have to dies such a cruel torturous death. And John the Baptist was "washing away the sins of the world " before Jesus came on the scene. So once again again proving that Jesus didn't have to die for our sins.

Jesus had to suffer because suffering is part of sacrifice, and Jesus was the “Lamb of God”, who takes away the sins of the world. 

Still doesn't answer why though does it? have you ever taken the time to thin about it? God be the super duper all singing all dancing god that you believe he is could have just as well said - "all the this sins committed by mankind are forgiven" and with a wave of his mighty hand it would have been done, no need for anyone to be beaten nearly to death, no need for anyone to be nailed to a cross and no need for a single drop of blood to be shed... at all!

"Debby wrote: Moses wrote the first Five books in the Old Testament.

Deuteronomy 34:5-7

So he wrote about himself dying and the funeral arrangement after he had died did he?

 It is clear beyond doubt that there is more than one single god being referred to in these scriptures, if these scriptures are to be taken at face value. It is a fact that every ancient civilisation recognised that other gods existed. Even the god of gods recognized this fact as did the sons of Gods who came to earth and raped the daughters of mankind.

Even the Ancient Hebrew God recognised this to be so. He actually commands 

1.   “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before Me.

So here this god himself recognises other gods and wants his particular chosen people not to put any of these other gods above him. He goes on to say he is jealous, what has he to be jealous of if no other gods exist?

 The Jewish list of commandments simply says:

“You shall not recognize the gods of others in My presence".(Sh’mot 20:1-5).

 So again you see, this god, the god of the Hebrews is indeed recognising other gods.

And there is this deafening passage that makes it very plain and clear:

Psalm 82

God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.....

I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

Pleased, deny the fact until the blood runs from your ears but it is a fact that you cannot change as much as you try.

His [ Stephen's]profile says he is a Christian, but not a practicing Christian. That’s like being accepted by a college but too dumb to attend classes. The end result is failure.

You really are a master of dumb statements aren't you "Debby"?

I didn't walk into a church at birth and demand to be Christened you thick FKR! It was against my will . Oh and I did attend...... under fkn duress you absolute clown.

What I did do though , and under my own free will was read, scrutinise and study the bible And a lot closer than you'll ever live to, bible dunce

Now why don't you address the OP ..... if you are capable.

And you must do better than saying this pile of shite!:

Debby wrote: The language in the Bible was designed to wean the people away from believing in many gods

Is that it!!!? FFS! The BIBLE states there are many gods you absolute clown. But here you are denying even those words that were spoken by YOUR god himself.

The Christians dogma still,to this day, insist that there was and is, only ever has been, only one god. This is a lie and the odd thing about their insistence is that their own scriptures state to the contrary.

Why is it that they have settled on the preferred idea of an omnipotent and everlasting single, male god?

When we actually look at the biblical text we see that even the Judeo/Christian bible says that god was not alone I his environment. I am sure many now are familiar with this verse that blows the Christian dogma of “only one god” clean out of the water.

 And God said, Let US make man in our image, after OUR likeness: Genesis 1:26

And there is the famous and no getting away from, Psalm 82 that clearly states;

Psalm 82

God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.....

I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

And there is the commandment where god refers again to other gods:

Exodus.20:3

 “You shall have no other gods before me”.

Genesis 11:7

“ let US go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

Psalm 95:3

 For the Lord is a great God, and a great King above all gods.

Psalm 135:5

For I know that the Lord is great, and that our Lord is above all gods.

This is not to mention that these gods had families; sons of gods when descended to earth and took the daughters of men as wives..

And there are many occasions in the bible where one god is ordering the death of those who have or are supporters of other gods.

Deuteronomy 6:14-16

 Ye shall not go after other gods, of the gods of the people which are round about you;

15 (For The Lord thy God is a jealous God among you) lest the anger of the Lord thy God be kindled against thee, and destroy thee from off the face of the earth.

16 Ye Shall not tempt the Lord your God, as ye tempted him in Massah.

So it's plain to see that there are other gods who were without doubt recognised and acknowledged by the Hebrew/ Judeo/Christian god. And this Hebrew./Judeo/Christian god is a self confessed “jealous god” and would kill and make to suffer for generations anyone who preferred one of these other gods to him.

 Who will deny this pluralism?Well Christians of course.

The usual Christian Reasoning is either to say that the “us " is the Trinity or that it is a heavenly assembly of angels.

 But can we really believe that the original audience for Genesis would understand the strictly Christian conception of an idea that had its roots in Rome thousands of years after? And the scripture doesn’t mention an “assembly of angels” but an assembly of “gods” plural

That should shake his comfort zone.

You are the one that is way out of your own indoctrinated "comfort zone, thicky.

And here are yet another two questions that you keep failing to answer, so when you are ready thicko.

You said above : "The devil chose to disguise as a serpent to approach Eve". 

Some tell me, What kind of serpent?

And you STILL!!! haven't told us how this episode was written about consider that there were only to beings present? So when you are ready,

DavidAZ wrote:God doesn't have a right arm,[...........................................]  Why wouldn't the phase walking to a fro be a metaphor for him traveling the Earth.

Why would it be a metaphor?

StephenWrote:I see. so when Satan himself tells god that he has been Walking to and fro upon the earth, he didn't mean physically walking ? You christians just love making shite up when you have no answers to these little niggling anomalies do you.

Stephen wrote:Stop it! So why not take human form if he is able to change his form and simply speak as a human would do to another human?

DavidAZ wrote:That would be way to obvious considering that Adam and Eve were the only two made.

That can't be right can it!? The animals were created first and they, The Adam and his "wife" Eve, were given dominion over all of them including " over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.".

So again, you are just trying to swerve by making shite up as you go.