Not a noob I know but he’s new to our site and meta and I’m not sure how common bullet proof is in other mafia sites. it’s very common from DART though and the character complexity means it’s either a fake claim or he had deep knowledge of the theme in conjunction to being lucky to be right about Bps being popular on dart if that makes sense. Also it’s not a fake claim mafia would feel safe claiming so I think it’s more likely real
The claim seems too complex for a noob to make up personally part of the reason I’m actually buying it
If a town player think's that their role is so critical that lynching them will cripple town, they can make the judgement call on whether to claim or not. If we in the process of deliberation we get full claims from all the characters within POE it will likely give them some vulnerability to scum and we are, by definition, not going to lynch all of them so it means that we will be giving whatever town-confirmed players which survive vulnerability.
This take is absolutely fvcking retarded btw lol. If your at l-1 you claim. If you are town and think you can pull off an effective lie, do it, but if it backfires you are basically throwing. But I will argue this with you all day, it is ALWAYS better to comply then to get mislynched for being obstinate. The second you set the standard that mafia can avoid claiming by throwing a fit and stamping their foot, the second the game gets ruined. People like royal paladin would play that card ALL the time back on DDO, and it became so un fun to play with her and people like her. I encourage intelligent lying, austin does it, I do it, just know that if you are a power role you take a calculated risk doing so. If you don't think you can lie effectively, sometimes its worth outing a power role as opposed to mislynching the person. Town don't get many mislynches, the more we can avoid doing it the better. Too many variables that can effect power roles anyways, like mafia actions or town mis-use. We shouldn't have to rely on investigative results to carry us anyways. So I'd 100% rather someone claim cop for example and avoid getting mislynched than take it to their grave and die anyway.
Lunatic is now also one of my top scumreads for pushing for another full claim with POE
What are you talking about? I've been pushing mikal. Thoth is at l-1 and honestly still is likely getting lynched. Thats what you do at l-1. You claim. He is probably getting lynched either way and I am not really sold he's scum. But again I didn't push this lynch, just encouraged that he should claim since he's at l-1.
Because it is would scum would claim to explain why they have not been night-killed?
Its a common fake claim and it limits the number of protection roles town could reasonably have. But I am considering it, because like I said, I still am leaning towards scum being mikal and I dont think both scum are on those results.
Bulletproof isnt the easiest claim for me to buy.
Time to claim here man.
I will check in tonight and maybe tomorrow before I leave, but I'll be away on another camping trip till Tuesday so I might not be very active for the next few days.
No one goes camping more than once a summer. Obvious scum!
Ultimately I don’t think Thoth is scum here. His push on Whiteflame is who almost the most agreed upon townie right now seems counter intuitive for a mafia stratagem, which leads me to believe that the read while outlandish in so many regards, is probably legitimate.
I would be okay with shining except that i dont feel we learn anything if he is town, and we’ve made the mistake of lynching earth before for dubious reasons. This time he happens to be incriminated by results so I’d feel less bad about getting it wrong.
Mikal feels scummiest to me out of the three on the lynch. His actions in regards to Whiteflame never sat right with me and his subsequent explanation for his actions feels very weak to me. That plus his overreaction to the pressure he recieved at the time felt extremely fake, almost more of an intimidation tactic to threaten town for screwing up and shame us for voting him until he realized it was really just me who was seriously pressuring him. That and his role isn’t as powerful as he suggests it is, and so far it doesn’t really make sense with a caroler. Unless exactly RT and Whiteflame are scum, we know that there is a caroler. So for Mikal’s role to be legit we have to assume there is a third investigative role that straight up gives results which might be true but also feels very powerful. It’s not out of the realm of possibility.
But the major thing giving me pause in Mikal is that the role he claimed was a role he and I had discussed fake claiming in biology mafia. I was the one who had suggested it and I remember Mikal really liking the fake claiming and wanting to use it, even after I had backed off of the idea of using it. It feels extremely convienent that Casey would pull this role to use out of a hat when it’s never been used before and the only ever time I can recall it being mentioned was when we discussed using it as a fake claim.
I’m going to attempt one last push against Mikal here to see what kind of support I can garnish, if we would really rather lynch shining or Thoth I will be on board as I do think the caroler results are likely legit, so we still stand to lynch scum correctly by following through. But yeah I’d rather lynch Mikal out of the three. His mild omgus doesn’t help my read against him either.
also my role is actually powerful. It confirms a role. You know how many games cop has been a fc or mafia can fake claim results. It allows us to mostly town lock someone unless you assume I and that person are scum
it only confirms a player to you, and still leaves you in question.
All of David’s tmi bothers me and would rather confirm that there isn’t a 1x use or some weird mafia thing. Affiliation is not confirmation. Surprised Luna does not bite with this as we have discussed it multiple times
i never said he was confirmed for being popular, i town read him for the Caroler results combined with what Whiteflame said regarding the circumstances about his results. That and we literally just had a scum popular and psyche suggests Casey wouldn’t throw it in back to back as scum especially when she was scum in the last game with the scum popular. Only thing I thing is wierd about RT is his obsession with Thoth and willingness to continue to suspect him over everything including “game abuse” for discussing our soft claim meta outside the site which seems a bit absurd to me.
I saw it and took note of it. Just playing this DP close to the chest. I figured you had some kind of result but didn't want to press the issue or draw attention to it when there was more important stuff to pay attention to. Something like the Whiteflame situation is the unfortunate result of focusing too much on roles and results. Honestly wish I had logged in once he started beating RT over the head with the fact that he was responsible for the oracle results. Would have unvoted.
Honestly y'all claim way too easy. I would've taken that shit to the grave even as town. Punish town for pushing for claims that we have no business outing DP2.
Nah nevermind, this whole response, reinforces the idea you are probably town lol.
I can't tell if that's just weird defense because Mikal isn't that invested in this game or if it's part of an effort to derail the lynch, though it's odd regardless.
Thats the other thing, I didn't really get the vibe he wasnt invested in this game, he only mentioned it when he had three votes on him (ironically I think all three votes happened for seperate reasons). I am kind of not buying the wifom there. Like even if he was scum I can see him just not caring about getting lynched because he's on vacation (Honestly I wouldn't care either, vacation is more important than a forum game and there will be a million more mafia games in the future). It just seems like hes hyper inflating the pressure on him when I was probably the only one seriously scum reading him at the time lol
The townread from Luna is coming from somewhere, and even if I'm not sure where, it's the main reason why I might consider him town.
In regards to rex, the fact that he hasn't even mentioned this kind of makes me scratch my head. If he never saw me make that post for example its probably extra townie, but now I am wondering if he's scum and acknowledged it and is playing along.
I will say what happened favors him being town still, but its not out of the question he is scum.
I'm also still not happy that Thoth basically admitted to cheating.
I mean I don't really think talking about a game with a bunch of strangers who aren't familiar with the site let alone even have accounts here really qualifies as cheating. That's like saying me talking about the mafia game to my girlfriend is cheating lol
Mikal - So I know he's the likely lynch this DP, but I really don't think he's scum. The way this DP played out has left me frustrated on a lot of levels, but if Mikal's goal was to seek my claim for scummy reasons, he did a terrible job of it. I was near certain that he didn't have a Tracking role because if he'd seen me visit RT, he wouldn't have sought my claim. And if he was scum, I don't think he steers clear of VTLing me like he did here. Maybe scum Mikal makes this fake claim and pairs it with an apparently pretty spot on character for the role, but this seems baked into the structure of this game really well. It's a way to get around anti-claim and test those that do claim. I don't think it was used well here (personal bias), but in a game with at least a Follower and a Caroler to yield investigative results, his claim makes a good deal of sense.
Interesting town read. I guess my question is what was his goal really in pushing you? He hasn't really made it understood why he was pushing you when you had already specifically told him you didn't get a result. The whole circumstances around his push on you didn't make a ton of sense, and felt almost like he thought he could catch you in something scummy for mislynch potential, and it seemed at this point he was confident enough in his position that he didn't think there would be major back lash for doing it. I just don't understand what as town he was trying to accomplish, and again, it is really weird to me that the only time I have ever seen this role talked about or discussed let alone used was when me and mikal talked about fake claiming this in your biology game.
Low-key it kinda feels good to die when town plays shitty lol.
Town is playing shitty because you have a couple of votes that you are "too lazy" to defend against? By definition, if you are town here you are also playing shitty. I get you are on vacation, but come on.
but yeah, I don’t have the energy or care enough to make a case. If you lynch me, you lose a strong investigation role.
Also I would not consider this a STRONG investigation role, in fact I dont think Ive ever seen this role used in a game before me and you discussed using it as a fake claim.
I clarified specifically why I pushed wf, and why I’m wanting to test rt.
But whiteflame did specifically tell you multiple times he didn't have results and you still kept pushing him. Why?
vtl mikal
I really don't appreciate WF outting his role.
He basically got coerced into it.
I also don't understand why he wants to test RT again, it seems pretty foolish to me. Ah well. I do think the way you guys tested RT's popular are a little silly.
That was rex that suggested testing him again.
Thus, town Beholders should not be included in setups where massclaiming would otherwise be powerful.)
Beholder can be both town and mafia. In this case the beholder is more likely a mafia role. https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Beholder#Use_&_Balance
Not to mention we've been told by the mod that many claims will hurt town.
Thus, town Beholders should not be included in setups where massclaiming would otherwise be powerful.)
Beholder can be both town and mafia. In this case the beholder is more likely a mafia role. https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Beholder#Use_&_Balance
Not to mention we've been told by the mod that many claims will hurt town.
Man, if this is real, it's such a frustrating reason to draw attention to me, especially after I said twice that I did not receive a result. I get that your vote wasn't up on me, but getting my claim should not have been necessary to confirm this.
I'll leave it there for now, though.
Its not just frustrating, that should be downright suspicious. What the hell?
I’m the beholder. I get informative information back if I target an information role. I was told
you did not receive information. You implied you were visiting someone, so I wanted to see if you were going to lie and fake claim a result.
Interesting. I want to make a note here, that this was a role me and mike were heavily considering fake claiming in whiteflames bacteria game. I have never seen this role before we discussed using it there, it would be mad convenient if casey pulled this role out of a hat.
I feel like I've hinted every way I can to prevent this, and you are literally the person that should be picking up what I'm putting down, so fuck it. I'll embrace the fact that I'm almost certainly dead tonight: I targeted you. I'm the Caroler. Happy? I know I'm not.
I feel like you were pretty fvcking obvious here. smh
I don’t trust a dreamer outright. It’s something to consider
If you don't trust a dreamer, or caroler, or whatever it is, why aren't you suspecting RT?
I am sincerely at a loss regarding this vote. You should be more confident than anyone here that you have the name of at least one scum on that list of three. Why is my claim your priority?
Yeah its very interesting that he isn't wanting to focus on his supposed results.
It depends on how casey divvies dreamer results too. Technically both scum can be on a dreamer result, but I feel like most mods dont really do that for mod psyche reasons. Like if we were to systematically start lynching through your results, and hit both scum, mafia would be pretty pissed. So I feel like the mod would leave one outside, so if your results are to be believed, then its one of the three on your results, plus ultra. Obviously a lot of that is mod psyche with early game POE, but that's where I am at.
Out of your POE who do you think is most likely to flip wolf?
Tough to say right now, let's see how this day phase plays out. I want to hear why mike is scum reading whiteflame though.
As of right now my POE is thoth, ultra, shining and mike. I have decent reason to town read everyone else.
